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Author Topic: stern thrusters question  (Read 29901 times)

CaptainMike1

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #100 on: July 12, 2008, 10:58:55 »

Well said, Fred!

PS I still want vertical take-off jets for Latitude. Then I can get her into Portsmouth Harbour...  ;D


Never seen anything like a latitude in Portsmouth Harbour, I think a couple of good dredgers would be a good start!
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maritiem

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #101 on: July 12, 2008, 11:55:53 »

 :o so many posts already i didn't expect that!
but i see that some people think that Vstep will remodel the vermaas AND THAT IS NOT TRUE i was just wondering why those huge ships don't have stern thrusters and that is clear for me.
and btw please stay on topic i have seen someone started talking about cheese.  :-X

kind regards maritiem
« Last Edit: July 12, 2008, 12:03:08 by maritiem »
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People can almost do anything, The only thing they can't is forgive each other.

TerryRussell

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #102 on: July 12, 2008, 12:33:06 »

and btw please stay on topic i have seen someone started talking about cheese.  :-X

kind regards maritiem

Hi Maritiem.

I have cleaned up this thread and removed the provacative and seriously off-topic posts.  ;)
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mvsmith

  • Guest
Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #103 on: July 12, 2008, 15:40:06 »

Terry,
What I want to know is: Why didn’t VSTEP put bow thrusters on Red Eagle? ;D
Marty
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TerryRussell

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #104 on: July 12, 2008, 15:45:05 »

Hoho.

And what about the vertical take off jets for Red Jet 4?
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CaptainMike1

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #105 on: July 12, 2008, 15:50:52 »

Terry,
What I want to know is: Why didn’t VSTEP put bow thrusters on Red Eagle? ;D
Marty


Probably because the real Red Eagles don't have them?

There is a good link here which shows the Red Osprey being stretched.

http://www2.redfunnel.co.uk/ferry-travel/passenger-vehicle-ferry-service/vehicle-ferry-fleet/red-osprey-picture-gallery
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James89uk

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #106 on: July 12, 2008, 15:56:22 »

As I think this topic has established, stern thrusters are not always required on ships.  They are usually used whilst manoeuvring on/off a berth, anchoring or performing other manoeuvres.  Cruise ships also use them when they are at anchor and need the keep the ship in a certain position, in order to to ensure passengers/crew can embark/disembark from the sheltered side of the vessel.

I'm working within the cruising industry, but the same principles are likely to apply to other ships - just be aware that for larger vessels (e.g. container ships and tankers), the numbers quoted below may be very different.  From what I am aware though...

Bow or stern thrusters cannot be used at sea, whilst sailing at speed.  They are usually switched on whilst approaching a port at around 10 knots.  At 4 knots the thrusters are 50% effective, and for anything above 8 knots, they have little effect on the ships course.  Some ships also have systems in place to prevent the thrusters being used at too high a speed.  Most new cruise ships have two or three bow thrusters, along with 2 (sometimes 4) azipods.  Stern thrusters are simply not needed since the azipods perform, in part, the same function.  Some slightly older cruise ships may have one or two stern thrusters, but these are rarely used - apart from anchoring when the wind is blowing.

You may wonder why these ships have multiple thrusters - why not make do with just one?  Well, there are several possible reasons, but one of the main ones is that if one of your thrusters goes wrong, you have others to use as backup - this is of particular importance when performing a manoeuvre where you have little room for error.  There are also some ports (again, particularly relevant to the cruising industry), where no thrusters can be used within a specific distance from the pier - in such ports, tugs must be used to help berth the ship.

James
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Traddles

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #107 on: July 12, 2008, 16:05:04 »

Hi MH1,
Marty's post was a Joke, or did you not catch on? Wake up your humour department!!!
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Retired, UK foreign going Masters Ticket.

budbud

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #108 on: July 12, 2008, 16:09:40 »

Hi

Quote
You may wonder why these ships have multiple thrusters - why not make do with just one?
There are two mains reasons for that: The redundancy is one of them. The second one is that the thrust of the propeller depends mainly on the diameter and the speed. Increasing speed means increase problems of cavitation. And increasing the diameter raise obviously a problem of space in the hull. So for a same among of thrust needed, it 's better to have several thrusters than a bigger one.
Budbud
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C'est curieux ce besoin que les marins ont de faire des phrases!

TerryRussell

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #109 on: July 12, 2008, 16:18:23 »

Hi MH1,
Marty's post was a Joke, or did you not catch on? Wake up your humour department!!!

Doh! Even my "hoho" comment didn't give it away?

Still after some of the previous posts, I'm nor surprised MH1 missed the joke. It is getting difficult to tell the humour from the ridiculous...  ;D
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CaptainMike1

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #110 on: July 12, 2008, 16:24:16 »

Hi MH1,
Marty's post was a Joke, or did you not catch on? Wake up your humour department!!!

Surely it should have been posted as smalltalk/jokes then?

There are so many seemingly 'silly' questions posted on the forum now that it is difficult to seperate the true from the silly!!!

 ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
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The Captain

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #111 on: July 12, 2008, 16:36:41 »

Hi guys,

I think this "yes, but if..."  part of the discussion doesn't lead anywhere.

Even with the 'fake' vessels, they will NOT add unrealistic features or control methods.

The Vermaas, for example, might not really exsist, but ships just like her do in fact exsist in real life. Fake name, real ship. period.

Those ships do not have stern thrusters, so the Vermaas will not have one. Because it is supposed to be a realistic model of that type of ship.

Captains in real life have to make do with what they have, and so do you PC Captains. That's why it is a sim, not an arcade game.

And it indeed takes a whole lot of work to add such a feature to that one ship. it's not like "sticking in a virtuel prop on, and here we go!".  A load of coding is involved, testing, etc.. 

I don't care if you think that the ones that don't need them won't have to use them, they are not there in real life, so they won't be there in the simulator.

Then they could be adding all sorts of silly things to the ships to make it easier for the ones that don't know how to handle them, or are unwilling to learn properly.

Period, end of story, not going to happen. Learn to sail her better and that's about enough of this constant ignorant repeat of a futile request by some of you that cannot take a hint!

Sorry if that sounded really grumpy.... it was meant to.. 

Regards,
Fred


I do not want V-STEP to remodel the vermaas! I thought!,(KEY WORD THOUGHT!)that it would have been better if they had put a stern thruster and/or a second engine on the vermaas! You know, this is the 6th!,time I had said this, yet, no one pays attention >:(. If all of you had paid any attention, this wouldent have gone on 5 pages >:(!
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mvsmith

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #112 on: July 12, 2008, 17:06:10 »

MH1,
Had you followed the entire tiresome topic, you might have understood the context in which my remark was made. Too many posters, most of them juveniles, jump into a topic with no real understanding of what it is about.
Marty

The Captain,
It wasn’t so much about remodeling as about your silly suggestion that thrusters should have been included in the first place.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2008, 17:10:58 by mvsmith »
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CaptainMike1

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #113 on: July 12, 2008, 17:15:02 »

Marty

The whole topic is pointless if you go right back to the first post from maritiem, one could assume that people who have an interest in SS08 have at least some concept of how ship's operate.

I agree with you entirely, but i must admit that i often do not go back and read every thread in a topic, far too long some of them and there are not enough hours in the day.

Take Terry's amusing Marmite topic for example!

Mike
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TerryRussell

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #114 on: July 12, 2008, 17:18:09 »

Ah, but the marmite topic is entertaining.

And at no point has anyone been bad tempered in it. If only all topics could be so much fun!

PS I still want a jump-jet version of Latitude.
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mvsmith

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #115 on: July 12, 2008, 17:59:11 »

Hi James,
Thanks for your thoughtful input. Where were you when we needed you five pages ago? :)

I might add that for vessels like Vermaas there are other considerations that work against stern thrusters:
The wide stern, with shaft alley and other machinery makes it difficult to fit a tunnel thruster—which would suffer from the long tunnel. On the other hand, her draft leaves little room for an azimuthing thruster.
Regards,
Marty
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The Captain

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #116 on: July 12, 2008, 20:05:04 »

Fello forum members. It is in my honest opinion that it would have made a nice feature to any vessel. However, I see that I am a single apple on one branch, surrounded by other apples on all the other branches, wishing that a young apple such as myself had not been made into an apple at all. It seems that I stand out from all the rest of you apples out there. So.....

I do apoligise for any disturbence that has been made. I opoligise for my silly idea. I just thought it was creative and that it would make a fine addition to any ship. If no one likes my idea, so be it. But I still beleive in it, no matter what. A good person should never let go of an idea, just because all the other apples say to ;D... But, again, I do apoligise for anything that want wrong in this topic. I take full responibility. :-[. I am very very sorry :'(......................................................
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Agent|Austin

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #117 on: July 12, 2008, 20:08:42 »

I do not want V-STEP to remodel the vermaas! I thought!,(KEY WORD THOUGHT!)that it would have been better if they had put a stern thruster and/or a second engine on the vermaas! You know, this is the 6th!,time I had said this, yet, no one pays attention >:(. If all of you had paid any attention, this wouldent have gone on 5 pages >:(!

But you WOULD HAVE TO remodel a ship for this to be able to happen. As though the hull is too wide at the stern for a thruster currently it would have a long tunnel that would make it worthless in maneuvering so the hull would have to be re-shaped.
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The Captain

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #118 on: July 12, 2008, 20:09:53 »

Agent, I really dont want to get back into that right now. I am having a moment of shame ;D. Perhaps we can talk more about this tommoro ;).
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Agent|Austin

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #119 on: July 12, 2008, 20:10:25 »

Agent, I really dont want to get back into that right now. I am having a moment of shame ;D. Perhaps we can talk more about this tommoro ;).
Okie dokie. With marmite on top *yuck*
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The Captain

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #120 on: July 12, 2008, 20:11:19 »

You and me can talk more about it a pm, shall we?

Why is marmitime yuck. Isint he a forum member?
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Agent|Austin

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #121 on: July 12, 2008, 20:13:17 »

You and me can talk more about it a pm, shall we?

Why is marmitime yuck. Isint he a forum member?

"Marmite" the stuff terry likes. *yuck* sure PM me.
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The Captain

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #122 on: July 12, 2008, 20:13:59 »

What is marmitime? I am completely clueless ??? ;D.
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Agent|Austin

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Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #123 on: July 12, 2008, 20:15:02 »

What is marmitime? I am completely clueless ??? ;D.

MARMITE not marmitime...

It is this yucky stuff, maybe you should ask terry, he is a marmite addict.
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TerryRussell

  • Guest
Re: stern thrusters question
« Reply #124 on: July 12, 2008, 20:15:47 »

Fello forum members. It is in my honest opinion that it would have made a nice feature to any vessel. However, I see that I am a single apple on one branch, surrounded by other apples on all the other branches, wishing that a young apple such as myself had not been made into an apple at all. It seems that I stand out from all the rest of you apples out there. So.....

I do apoligise for any disturbence that has been made. I opoligise for my silly idea. I just thought it was creative and that it would make a fine addition to any ship. If no one likes my idea, so be it. But I still beleive in it, no matter what. A good person should never let go of an idea, just because all the other apples say to ;D... But, again, I do apoligise for anything that want wrong in this topic. I take full responibility. :-[. I am very very sorry :'(......................................................

Hi The Captain.

As with all of the suggestions that get made, people can have very strong ideas about it.

Personally I wouldn't want thrusters on vessels that don't have them in real life. But, I wouldn't go shouting at someone who does want them. I might pull their leg ("jump jets"), but that's in fun.

So, as far as I am concerned, you have nothing to say sorry about. You started an innteresting discussion, in which a few people got a bit over-excited.


To celebrate your idea, I have now completed a new mission which involves Vermaas in som every tight moves. It is "Master's Certificate - Part 1", and will be available via the Creator's Forum within the next few days, once it has received final testing and release.

If you don't want to join up (it's free), I will release via the Custom Missions section of this Forum in due course (I allow at least three months before releasing here).
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