The European Union

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[Captain Davies]

As for decentralised governments- not sure I agree with you there, Capt D. The Scottish parliment building for example ran millions over budget, yet has not improved anything in Scotland. It makes it easier though to swallow up into a federal europe.

Well in my opinion the welsh Assembly has done a far better job catering for the needs of Welsh people that the Parliament in London ever has.

Capt D- on the German/British DNA- there are many similarities don't you think. Just look at the German humour for example, just like ours (very dry)

Agreed.

[Orinoco]

Well in my opinion the welsh Assembly has done a far better job catering for the needs of Welsh people that the Parliament in London ever has.

You mean like longer waiting lists for operations?

[Sam]

Well, you English people just allways have to do difficult .
Driving on the wrong side of the road 

But I do not agree why u say that the € is weaker than the pound, if you change now, than you will get something arround 1,5 € per pound.
You just have to learn to use it.

Before we had the € in Belgium, we payed in francs.
1€ = 40,... francs          If that aint a difference!
So somethging that costed 2000 francs before costs now €50.

But why do you fear getting ruled by another country, Belgium is in the E.U and still has it own politics!

[marcstrat]

Greetings,
Yes,and when i go on holidays in France,i do not have to change money anymore.So the bank cant rip you of anymore,with the exchange rate of money.
Regards
Marc

[redbeard]

But I do not agree why u say that the € is weaker than the pound, if you change now, than you will get something arround 1,5 € per pound.
You just have to learn to use it.

Then € is weaker my friend 

But why do you fear getting ruled by another country, Belgium is in the E.U and still has it own politics!

Here in Norway we are decentrelising cause of problems with having all the different goverment departments centrelised in our capital. Decentrelising is also a good way to populate the contry. We have a lot of small towns in Norway, and we need to keep them populated to keep our different industries, even though its not always that profitable. If we center all politics in Belgium the politicians will not get the "feel" of what is happening locally in Norway or the towns. They only watch statistics, you cant see the Norwegian culture and see what we need as Norwegians from statistics. Sometimes we need to do things non-profit to keep the people satisfied. Centrelising and privatisation of some fundamental goverment bussineses is not the way to go. Dont missunderstand me. Im not against making money, but no matter at all costs.

We are a small country, therfor we are not going to get many delegates in the EU parlament, and also not getting many votes. I dont want EU to deside what to do with and in Norway. I am affraid that they will suck out all our resources, and since we are a small country, we will not get mutch back. Why do you think we are fighting of all the Spanish trawlers in North-Norway?

In 1814 we got our own constitution and 1905 we finally got our own king, after several hundreds of years of fighting with the Swedish and Danish. I dont want to loose my sovereigty and independance as a Norwegian. If Norway joins EU and agrees to a joint constitution, I will... I think the Norwegian nasjonality is very important to the most of us. It is part of our culture.

EU si going to be like a cind of a republic in the future. Like a big version USA. I dont want to be a part of that. Nothing wrong with that, is it? We can still be friends, trade, respect each other and do whatever neighbours do. 
Norway is still a part of the EEC. A rotten deal for us, but we have to live with it to keep us outside EU, I guess.

This is my oppinion, and not every Norwegians offcourse. 

/cheers

[strassenkreuzer]

I think, its funny that only the people who are not in the EU (British and Norwegian), are anti EU. Is there anybody anti EU who knows what he talks about?

[Sam]

Actually, I don't know a lot of politics.

But I am talking about what I experienced while changing into E.U.

I had to addapt myself but it only became better after it.



@Redbeard;

Have you red what I said?
The pound is another unit!
In numbers it is higher than the €, but not in valeu.
You do not come with facts, what you say is just an opinion.

[Orinoco]

I think, its funny that only the people who are not in the EU (British and Norwegian), are anti EU. Is there anybody anti EU who knows what he talks about?

Er, the UK IS in the EU.

Ok, you want some reasons:

1) The EU is corrupt. It has never had its accounts signed off.
2) There is nothing the EU does that we cannot accomplish ourselves.
3) The EU charges an extortionate 'membership' fee.
4) The EU intends to split European Countries into 'Autonomous Territorial Entities'
5) The EU looks more like a State every day, this is not the direction a trade body should be taking.
6) The UK's largest single trading partner in the world is the USA. This proves that we don't need a supra-national organisation telling us what to do, we don't need EU laws and we don't need common standards or foreign regulations. So as above, the EU is a waste of space.
7) The EU erodes National Sovereignty, it's stupid rules put British people out of business.
8 ) For every £1 the EU spends in the UK, it costs the UK £2.60.

et cetera, et cetera.

[Orinoco]

Actually, I don't know a lot of politics.

But I am talking about what I experienced while changing into E.U.

I had to addapt myself but it only became better after it.



@Redbeard;

Have you red what I said?
The pound is another unit!
In numbers it is higher than the €, but not in valeu.
You do not come with facts, what you say is just an opinion.

What do you mean?

The £ does have a higher value. £1 is worth €1.50, £1 is worth $2.

[Eemspoort]

I'm anti-EU.

Only good thing, don't have to change money anymore.
The bad thing, everything is double the price since the Euro.

I'm not going to express me feelings abaut the EU. Most things are allready said.

[redbeard]

I think, its funny that only the people who are not in the EU (British and Norwegian), are anti EU. Is there anybody anti EU who knows what he talks about?

I most sertanly know what im talking about.  Aperantly you dont, my friend. UK has been in EU for a very long time.

@Redbeard;

Have you red what I said?
The pound is another unit!
In numbers it is higher than the €, but not in valeu.
You do not come with facts, what you say is just an opinion.

Hehe... Yep I have read it. Several times actually, cause i couldnt understand how you can beleeve that € is more worth than £.
If you have 1€ and want to buy £, you get 0,68£. Did this explain it for u? 

And about the facts:
- It is a fact that we had were fighting with the Danish and Swedish for several hundred years. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norway (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norway) (Jump down to the section about history  )

-How can you argue with the fact that norway is decentrelising and our experiences with centrelising?

-I actually work with economics and marketing, so I know for a fact that if you are gonna govern / rule a country / business far apart from the source, you have to rely a 100% on statistics.

-Its a fact that Noway would probably get arround 11 delegates in the EU parlament. We do not get a lot of wotes then vs Germanys 99 delegates.
Small countries have almost nothing to say vs largly popullated countries in the EU. Read the Treaty of Nice http://europa.eu.int/eur-lex/lex/en/treaties/index.htm (http://europa.eu.int/eur-lex/lex/en/treaties/index.htm)

The rest is my opinion, thats my freedom of speech. And I'll quote my self on it:

This is my oppinion, and not every Norwegians offcourse. 

[Berger]

I'm glad Norway aint a part of EU

[marcstrat]

Greetings,
Do we need this discusion about the EU,on this forum !!
It becomes sometimes hot,and this is not the idea of this forum.
We can better st&art talking about something else than politics.
Regards
Marc

[Eemspoort]

I agree with Marc. That's why i didn't gave my opinion on this matter. Because it would get to hot to handle. 

Mebay it's best if we would close this one by our selves, and agree on not discussing politics on this forum again?

[redbeard]

Hehe.. You are right i guess. Politics involve a lot of feelings. I just cant shut-up when it comes to something im absolutely against.. For my part, I have said what I had to say about my opinion... I agree to disagree 

[Stuart2007]

I think, its funny that only the people who are not in the EU (British and Norwegian), are anti EU. Is there anybody anti EU who knows what he talks about?

I find that a little offensive. Are you saying that anyone who voices an alternative opinion is wrong? This is a founding principle of fascism. But I suppose you realise this?

Look at the recent 'no' votes for the EU superstate- France principally- voted 'no' to European Superstate... Tells you all when even a founding country says the plan has gone wrong.

I am amazed that everytime I or anyone else says anything bad about the EU we're considered racists or nut cases... Which goes to show the rationale behind the EU.

Sam: Without patronising anyone, at 16 you have't experience of the working environment to know the full effects of EU law. In one respect, the Euro makes it easier to deal with my French business partners. Yet, I estimate the effect of disasterous EU policies are adding 13-14% to my annual costs. The red tape really is horrendous. The EU in principle is a good idea, but in practice it is weakening our position against the rest of the world.

Stu

[Stuart2007]

PLEASE NOTE: I think we might be in danger of turning this thread into a slanging match. We all have our opinions and I have enjoyed taking part.

But there have been complaints from forum members that it might be causing offence.

PLEASE remember that if it oversteps the line then it will be closed.[/colour]

Stu

EDIT: Unfortunately this thread has caused one too many complaints, so regrettably it must be locked before one of the administrators becomes involved.