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Author Topic: Caroussel and other tugs  (Read 2735 times)

saltydog

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Caroussel and other tugs
« on: October 14, 2015, 04:56:01 »


Desired vessels/vessel types to be seen in upcoming Ship Simulator versions (limit to 3 choices):
1. Voith Schneider Tugs.
2. Inland Push Tug with flanking rudders.
3. Ro/Ro Car Carrier.


Hi aazevedo,

You can change the Bugsier to a Voith Schneider rotor tug, as described in this topic:

 http://forum.shipsim.com/index.php/topic,30681.0.html
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LucAtC

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Caroussel and other tugs 2
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2015, 13:56:12 »

Hello saltydog, aazevedo58,

This thread is no longer very much used, perhaps may I add to SD's comment that "Bugsier2 VSP rotor" was based on an existing concept, eventually not much used, no more until now than the Hybride concept mixing environmental protection and high bollard pull. Anyway, she is a Voith Schneider tractor tug with a Z propeller at the stern replacing partially the skeg while increasing the BP.
The VSP concept with one VSP at both ends could also be implemented in the simulation, but then I don't know what kind of controls should be used. The double ended ferries have specific controls, but for a tug operator I suspect such layouts wouldn't work well. Four hands would be needed indeed, unless azimuthal controls i.e. 2 joysticks were used, for instance. If you have suggestions for some configuration, they are of course welcome.

Regards,
Luc
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saltydog

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Caroussel and other tugs 2
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2015, 14:33:17 »

Hi Luc, I very much enjoy the VSP Bugsier and have it permanently
I have found some handy controls to use the stern azimuth thruster..(pic 2)
As for a tug with VSP's at both ends, I see no reason why the configuration should be any different to the Red Eagle.
 I have absolutely no problems controlling her.. (I use the numpad then).. :)

ps:  for the tug, I guess you mean something like this:
« Last Edit: October 14, 2015, 17:41:00 by saltydog »
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LucAtC

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Caroussel and other tugs
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2015, 23:24:40 »

I am glad that you like this VSP version of Bugsier2, because a big stern skeg instead of the stern thruster doesn't change much her handling versus that of the regular tractor configuration. It is then just easier due to the faster thrust orientation of the VSPs.

The RAVE arrangement is indeed what I meant, and configuring such dynamics is no different from others, "not a big deal" as soon as the underwater parts are well defined, even if the drawing or the design is flawed. The controls would be more difficult to tweak correctly. For instance, you use 4 keys for one VSP, a key to ahead, to astern, to port and to stbd. Double them for a second VSP control and try to explain it to players who jump from ship to ship. Moreover, it must be enough consistent with the bridge controls, and I am sure that the real ones are very different from the Maassluis ferry handles. Not that realistic controls are possible, but they should at least match the real ones good enough that an operator can instantly understand the layout, once he knows what is under water. Until now, I haven't seen a bridge equipment picture of such tugs.

The same goes for the towboat controls, of which the flanking rudder handles don't resemble the real rudder handles, due to the lack of a proper stick. It is also true that some explanations wouldn't have hurt too, but making oneself heard, or eventually understood, is a real pain when you don't really master the language.

Also, I was made aware that the à la Hamilton jets should be modified to better represent their manoeuvrability while stopped, but there was no demand for that, and although not very complicated, it wouldn't be very easy to keep track of the changes.It would mean adding a weak "virtual side thruster" synchronized with the wheel of the jet(s), and some other domestic dummies. It could remain WIP.

Regards,
Luc

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saltydog

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Caroussel and other tugs
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2015, 14:09:44 »

Sorry to be off-topic, but apparently RAVE is also experimenting with Voith-Schneider carrousel tug models.. :)

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGPWbxWrIlA
« Last Edit: October 15, 2015, 14:15:54 by saltydog »
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LucAtC

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Caroussel and other tugs
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2015, 19:46:51 »

You are right, saltydog, it is most probably Robert Allan Ltd expanding its tug concepts, like Novatug and the slightly smaller Multratug 12.
There is also another very well thought double ended tug, Giano tug. This one too could use the rock around the bridge towline arrangement.

Regards,
Luc

Edit
This discussion originated as an answer to aazeevedo questions
« Last Edit: October 16, 2015, 09:42:48 by LucAtC »
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saltydog

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« Last Edit: October 18, 2015, 11:08:22 by saltydog »
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LucAtC

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Re: Caroussel and other tugs
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2015, 20:00:05 »

Interesting indeed, 2 years to implement remote controlling is surely more than enough, it could be implemented in 2 or 3 months, as almost all controls are now fly-by-wire, and at least remote controlled from a PLC. Some valves probably, extended monitoring, camera surveillance, and klaar is Kees.

It remains to be seen if the towline could be operated without crew in a safe manner, meaning that this job seems to often require swiftness, dexterity and adaptability. Automatic and failsafe catching and fastening implies some new system known by the crews of the assisted ships.

Also, it would give more free time for the crews of the tugs. Perhaps could they use their smartphones to do their jobs?

Regards,
Luc
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