Vstep, release the mission editor

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[Subwolf]

I'm surprised to see there's no information about updates here, we still only have the 12 missions included when the game was released 4 months ago. Yes we're told an update is ready when it's ready, but that's no answer to customers after all this time.

At least Vstep should do something about it before Christmas, I believe that would repair some of the damage to company reputation if they manage to deliver a well working patch including the mission editor.

[mvsmith]

After all the vituperative and boorish complaints occasioned by VSTEP committing to a date without being sure they could meet it with a bug-free release, don’t you think it is silly of you to insist that they repeat that mistake?
Or are you hoping for an opportunity for more of that behavior?

[flaviossa]

Well, for me, if there is a good project manager taking care of Extreme, there is no problem giving a release date. If the staff is discovering more problems them they can deal with is another story ... 

[mvsmith]

By a “good project manager” you must mean one with a crystal ball.

[BeerBob]

Well, even if they don't know exactly when it will be released it must be possible to give us a general idea. Are we talking days, weeks or months? And why don't release some of the missions that must have been made by people testing the ME?

So far we haven't actually even got the vaguest of answers...

[mvsmith]

If you want a “general idea”, my estimate would be the early part of January. The reason you should not expect a “general idea” from VSTEP is the same reason that you will not get an estimate, or a guess: Some idiots would consider it a promise and we would see the same old rants.

[Subwolf]

Well, for me, if there is a good project manager taking care of Extreme, there is no problem giving a release date. If the staff is discovering more problems them they can deal with is another story ... 

True enough. We've been told they are working hard to get things sorted out, but I don't believe a word of it because they really shouldn't need half a year to repair their own software. I got a feeling there are not many people working on this for a reason, probably financial.

We're getting to a point where they should just release the mission editor as it is, after all it's possible to create missions. In a few months this game is considered old, and for me it's just taking up disk space since the few missions were finished a long time ago. What a sad story this is..

[krytsch]

The necessarily of repairing the software is a result of people in this forum, who keep shouting angrily for a release, before the software is ready!

I hope VStep doesn't listen to these people again.

[Mad_Fred]

Well said.

And Subwolf, you couldn't be further from the truth, and that's all I care to say about it, cause I feel there is no pleasing you no matter what, anyway. Because you're contradicting yourself now. First you want things fixed properly, now you wish for features to be released unfinished. So which is it?  And if they do, will you then come back on the forum and complain about it not working properly, or be happy with it 'as it is' and be cool about it?

Can't have it both ways, I'm afraid.. 


Regards,
Fred

[Atlantis05]

I think my opinion fits right between yours, Mad Fred, and yours, Subwolf.

On the one hand I must admit, half a year and no end in sight for getting a proper working game (including this half price sale a few days ago) is quite hard to take for a customer... if I would do this to mine, I would imidiately lose them. If I make an error, I must admit it and make the over-best to correct it.. and doing this as fast as possibile is of course self-evident!

VStep seems to have customers wich are quite calm and very very patient. But leaving them alone in such a way is hard to take. Remember,... on some PCs the game still doesn´t move a bit, on others there are so many bugs, that playing the game with invisible boats sinking yours is not quite that funny at all, some of them bought this game to take turns with the hovercraft (wich is not working yet) and some want to do other things wich were promised but not kept. In addition these ones still get to read that others played the hole game and are dissapointed that there is no fresh supply.. Also, when looking around, I hope, not all of the ones I know in my neighbourhood, will throw their game into some box in a far edge of the room because of running out of patience.

On the other hand, of course, I clearly understand that vstep must be working really hard to correct this issues - I do even belive, that it effects the ProShipSim cause I know some Instructors at the University who bought SSE to check out wether it fits in the teaching-plans and who where not very delighted. Adding this to the already upset customers I can´t see Vstep not taking hard work to correct everything.. I´m sure there will be some working overtime after overtime to satisfy my wishes..  , and of course the ones of quite a lot of SSE-Users..

Naturally Vstep won´t like to tell another exact date,.. just not beeing able to keep it, but informations sometimes keep up the understanding. Some good friend said once: The one that complain are still with us,.. the one stoping to complain are lost forever.

So please keep in mind, that there are still some out there, having the game around on their pc, not beeing able to play it the way they want. They even could have been buying it for 50% in the time between, instead of ordering the pre-release... they read every entry in the forum in hope of a solution.. and still keep calm and wait.

So let´s thank them for keeping up the hope.. at least early december  äh,.. I mean early january is not that far away any more  (sorry about this Fred  )

Regards,
Holger

By the way,.. Mad Fred,... I wouldn´t be keen on doing your job  and I am not even hopefull I could do it as half, no, as quarter as good as you do it  So stay calm and also thank you for doing it.

[Mad_Fred]

Hi Holger,

Firstly, thanks for those kind words, I really appreciate that. 
 
The points you have made a very fair indeed. And rest assured, no one is more concerned with the people that are dissapointed and frustrated about the problems, than Vstep is. They really want to see everyone happy with their puchase too, that goes without saying.

They are fully aware of it all, and indeed they are working very hard and indeed also putting in lots of overtime to correct it and further improve the game. But they can't do more than that to change what's wrong and give their fans the solutions to their problems so that they might enjoy the game as they had imagined beforehand. There's only so many hours in a day.

I myself, am not just a volunteer staff member, but also an avid ship simmer and I too have things I would have rather seen differently. And I too have the patience and the faith that is unfortunately needed at the moment to see this through. So I really do understand the issue on both sides of the fence. And I can even understand if people are slightly unreasonable because of money spent on a product that doesn't work as well as it should.

In a perfect world, it would have been different. But you can't changed what has happened, one can only do one's best to make up for it. And well, they never intend to leave the customers alone.. it's just such a tricky thing at this point in the proceedings to give detailed information, that it's best to keep the general idea out there and not go into specifics. Cause time and time again that backfires. But as we as staff write all over the place and you correctly assumed, they are really going all out on it, and as soon as there really is something to make public, they will do it right away. No ammount of intermediate news, or demands of the public, will make the actual work go any faster or the actual release take place any sooner. 

It looks as if it is silence on their part and that they're not bothered, but in actual fact the staff here does the talking for them whilst they crack on with it to get it done ASAP. Which is of course what everone wants in the end. What good are news updates if they ae vague and would potentially delay the progess further, anyway?

Vstep is very grateful that this community is largely made up of people that are indeed patient and who give them a chance to correct the problems they have with their purchase. I've seen many online gaming communities where this would not be the case. So this speaks for itself. 


Cheers!


Regards,
Fred

[Atlantis05]

That´s a word! 

Thanks a lot!

snowy regards
Holger

[Mad_Fred]

No problem.

And thank you aswell! 

And here's something that will perhaps help too:

http://80.95.161.114/shipsim/forum/index.php/topic,23083.0.html


Regards,
Fred

[Subwolf]

Well look at this, my post helped

[Ballast]

If you think that the ME is fixed overnight after your post yesterday, you couldn't be more wrong... 

[sadsid (†2016)]

If you think that the ME is fixed overnight after your post yesterday, you couldn't be more wrong... 

I second that 

[mvsmith]

Well look at this, my post helped

An entirely predictable response with a fine mix of arrogance and ignorance.

[Subwolf]

  = wink

Do you really think that I think it was fixed overnight?
Alright, enough jokes.

But this is some great news, exactly what I was looking for

[Ballast]

= wink

Do you really think that I think it was fixed overnight?
Alright, enough jokes.

But this is some great news, exactly what I was looking for

= laugh

 

[Atlantis05]

Wow,.. that´s good timing 

[Heikodewal]

And here's something that will perhaps help too:

http://80.95.161.114/shipsim/forum/index.php/topic,23083.0.html

Thanks for the release notes!  I think this is what Holger meant a little bit information, no hard dates needed.
Now we know what will be added/fixed in the release, and since it is more than I expected, I am not surprised it will take some more time and will wait patiently for it.

[Mad_Fred]

Yup I understand and agree with Holger's point, but even with that in mind, it wasn't possible to reveal the whole bit of into untill the patch was almost done and it was certain, through testing, that the things mentioned would actually work out as well.

The alternative is to post something that's only got part of what's in it.
But then, people will say 'what about this and what about that.. and is this in, and did you forget thát?' And it would get unnecessary complicated without actually changing the fact of what was coming.

So, coincidentally the point was raised right before an update was scheduled, but otherwise it's still a matter of being sure of what you're saying, before you tell the public about it. And as soon as Vstep is sure, they always post the news update. The rest is a matter of patience. 

And you're welcome, though the credits go to Frank, and thus Vstep, for putting them up. 


Regards,
Fred

[Subwolf]

I'd like to add a small comment to this fine discussion.

To me it looks like the moderators don't know much more than we do when it comes to update progress and further development of the game. I noticed mvsmith mentioned early December and then early January as possible release dates.

In my opinion it would be a good idea for Vstep to keep the moderators well informed so they can tell us about updates, progress and plans for the near future. Being open will result in less questions about this, and less moaning and ranting.

[saltydog]

I have absolutely no interest in reports on update progress..
I just patiently wait..

[Mad_Fred]

I'd like to add a small comment to this fine discussion.

To me it looks like the moderators don't know much more than we do when it comes to update progress and further development of the game. I noticed mvsmith mentioned early December and then early January as possible release dates.

In my opinion it would be a good idea for Vstep to keep the moderators well informed so they can tell us about updates, progress and plans for the near future. Being open will result in less questions about this, and less moaning and ranting.

We are very well informed, and you are very much mistaken. All the moderators actively test and follow the progress every day and on top of that we receive feedback behind the scenes here aswell.

But, as long as Vstep does not give the green light or decides to go public, we will be very careful and use very broad terms and such to avoid any 'last minute problems' making us look bad or giving people such as yourself food for more moaning and ranting, as you so nicely put it. 

Again, if you haven't really got a clue, that still doesn't mean your assumption is true. 


Regards,
Fred