Hey everybody, Kyle here. Yes I still peruse these forums, and I happened across this thread.. Specifically the discussion about my model.. and even more specifically, RMS Gigantic's comments, and I thought I should respond...
Now JHB has already put very well the reason why my model is "lower detail", but I just want to reiterate that...
I did not model, in 3D, every single detail that was possible on my Titanic, not because I was lazy, or "refused" to, as if I had somehow stomped my feet in anger over the prospect, or because I couldn't model... But because I simply had no choice. Virtual Sailor, as JHB said, is not a game for extremely high poly models, however, it can handle a lot of high resolution textures. This is why I skipped actually modeling several details, it's why the railings, davits, ladders, windows, etc. etc. are made of transparent textures instead of actually being modeled. It's to keep the poly count low, because it absolutely MUST be! If I had modeled every single detail in 3D, including the addition of details I left out, such as those rigging brackets, the thing would be unusable in Virtual Sailor! It would crash every single computer it came across.
On the other hand, Ship Simulator can handle high poly models, but it's no good when it comes to a large number of high resolution textures. Along with the fact that my ship was made with VS only in mind, in terms of modeling methods, and also the fact that my model has so many textures, it would make it impossible to import an use in Ship Simulator. For my exterior model alone, that has 335 textures, many of them beyond the maximum size that Ship Sim may allow... The interior alone has another 311 textures, also many of them large in size.. Then another 80 or so textures for the bridge, also many of which are sizable. That alone would make it impossible to work in Ship Sim (not trying to put down the Ship Sim's engine here, it's just that as far as I understand, it's sort of limited when it comes to textures). On top of that, my model would need HUGE optimizations in terms of modeling, many details would need to be completely remodeled... Not to mention the addition of collision models... It would simply be a mess. If I wanted to model a Titanic for Ship Simulator, I would have to start completely over again, building an entirely new Titanic model from the ground up, this time with Ship Sim in mind from the start. And, RMS Gigantic, if I were to build such a model, or just a model in general in which I need not worry much about poly count (If it was for Crysis, for instance), I would most certainly fully model all the details and more that you seem to miss so dearly and complain about on my Virtual Sailor model. I would not refuse to model any details, and I would be fully capable of modeling them.
On that note, Gigantic, I have seen your comments regarding my Titanic project from earlier on.. From a video of it in Crysis on Youtube, to two different threads here on Ship Sim, and you have went out of your way to put down my work and my model, desperately pointing out the most miniscule flaws... I recall one comment where you complained that I had not yet placed morse lamps on my model.. Surely you must have known it was not a finished model, which the finished version has now.. And you used that as some sort of excuse to put down my model... Yet you didn't seem to give the same consideration to Jason's model which, at least the version that's in SS08, misses many details, and is far less complete than mine (final version) in terms of actual details represented (whether those are 3D, partial, or 2D textures).. Then you go on to heap infinite praise upon Jason's model, and seemingly having very little to say that was positive regarding mine (not that you're obligated to do so). Perhaps you made those comments without knowing why I modeled it the way I did, and if so, I certainly hope you understand now...
And on the note of accuracy, I will certainly admit that my model is not perfect. There are a few details I surely missed somewhere. However, when I built it, I too used Titanic plans, the plans of Peter Davies-Garner, and the G/A plans. I probably used many of the same plans Jason did, and I also had the two volumes of Titanic: The Ship Magnificent to help me along greatly. I did, however, build mine independently and did not have any direct communications with those Titans of Titanic research at any point in my project. Of course I started my Titanic when I still had a LOT to learn about modeling, and over the year and a half I built my Titanic, I did learn a LOT. This video here shows it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_3neWO-ar0
As a result of that bad start, though, my model's accuracy in terms of measurement is indeed slightly off in some areas, whilst Jason's may be more accurate in that sense, but it's close, and, though I may be biased obviously, I believe mine to be one of the most detailed and accurate Titanic models currently freely/publicly available, along with Jason's, and that distinction doesn't seem to apply to very many virtual models of Titanic.
Titanic video 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZhTWsS8S7U
Titanic video 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWHEc6k0Gg0&annotation_id=annotation_752301&feature=iv
Interior video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vesjq4EX0Mk&annotation_id=annotation_980649&feature=iv
My final Titanic model converted for Crysis (this looks quite awesome): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KSrzKFhwDE
Argue with that if you'd like, but I challenge you to watch the videos and see the screenshots above (the latter of which are just stills from the video of my model in Crysis), and then come back without refusing to give any credence to it because of something like "Oh, the color is slightly off" or "He forgot to add a bracket" or "He placed this part two centimeters off center". You can complain about those things if you'd like, but I don't think for a moment that that negates all aspects of the model. And surely Jason's model has errors, too. Just because he also had Titanic plans and communicated with Titanic researchers does not mean his model is not also infallible. So to reiterate another point... Stop kissing Jason's stern and find something decent to say about other Titanic models for once, instead of eagerly pointing out the flaws and missing parts of those other models (especially if it's an unfinished model), then not doing the same for Jason's, and instead acting as if it's the most perfect model ever. Sure you'll say every now and then that his model is also incomplete, but you see the same issues on my model, then use that to completely discredit it.
I probably come across as quite offended or.. Well, slightly angry here.. And that's because I am, or at least was. I can only assume you took JHB's and my comments into consideration. One last thing about your comments... This is from another thread on this forum about the Crysis Titanic, which was an early BETA of my Titanic, many months ago...
"The colors in that one are too bright, the masts look to lean back too far, and it's missing morse lamps.
3 reasons the SS model is better off the top of my head within the first minute of video."
You made that same comment on Youtube for the related video. You had not one thing positive to say, it seemed, just nitpicking. Then you said this on that Crysis thread:
"Sorry, it's that I get offended when someone criticizes Mr. De Donno's hard work."
I think the comment speaks for itself. I'm not an easy person to offend, but I'm certainly offended that you would say something like that whilst doing that very thing to my hard work, and it was very hard work indeed. So have some consideration, and be fair for once!
Now, a bit more on the subject...
Unless Jason has done a huge amount of work and really pulled some big time work off, and if the good folks at V-Step really really want Titanic in the new game and feel that the world will wobble off of its axis and hurtle into the Sun if the Titanic is not in the game, I don't see it likely happening... Maybe I'm wrong, I don't know what's going on with that situation. One thing is for sure, though... My model certainly won't be showing up in this game, it would, as I said, simply be impossible. It was made with VS in mind. I'd have to build a whole new model with SS in mind... But don't expect that to happen, either... I would go insane if I had to model Titanic all over again. I'll have to let quite a bit of time go by before considering it.
On a final note, about those screen shots and Crysis video... The video, and the conversion to Crysis, was done by a Youtube user named "Graysnake2834"... Also keep in mind that you can't actually sail the ship in Crysis, it's just a prop or scene in the game, pretty much.
That's all for now.
Cheers.
Kyle.
