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Author Topic: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides  (Read 2132186 times)

The Ferry Man

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25500 on: March 23, 2016, 22:53:13 »

I agree - this was such a great place in its heyday!

larsdehaan

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25501 on: March 24, 2016, 16:11:50 »

Yeah, Unfortunatly there´s not alot to stick around for anymore.
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Dannypenguin

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25502 on: March 24, 2016, 21:37:50 »

Yeah, Unfortunatly there´s not alot to stick around for anymore.

Unfortunately I agree  :-\
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25503 on: April 09, 2016, 22:12:31 »

Im back! Managed to get locked out of my account and spent a while trying to get back into my account as I had put a bad email address in as my recovery
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Captain Cadet
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larsdehaan

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25504 on: April 11, 2016, 14:51:31 »

Seems like it was hardly worth the trouble.
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25505 on: April 11, 2016, 18:31:41 »

I know - Seems to be such a shame that the forum has seemed to completely dried up.
Its also a shame that my main computer doesn't run Ship Sim as I ended up buying a fancy Macbook Pro (retina) for university...
Such a shame though - I wonder if VSTEP would make parts of the game open source or something like that as Im tempted to see if it can be ported to something like OSX or even iOS as I would say that the new A9 chips could handle something like this due to their efficiency (clock speed isn't everything and so is raw number power)
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Captain Cadet
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Rbsanford

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25506 on: April 13, 2016, 01:48:47 »

Looks like there's a little reunion here...wow, I haven't posted in a while. I miss 2011.  :-\
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Today's weather:

http://www.lsmma.com/webcam/webcam_st.html

Not to sound cliched, but what a long, strange, trip it's been.

Mr Robville

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25507 on: April 13, 2016, 09:00:57 »

I wonder if VSTEP would make parts of the game open source or something like that as Im tempted to see if it can be ported to something like OSX or even iOS as I would say that the new A9 chips could handle something like this due to their efficiency (clock speed isn't everything and so is raw number power)

During my efforts to get modding capabilities into ShipSim, I worked with Questviewer a few times. It's a really obscure development kit with barely any resources and it has a learning curve steeper than the back of Mount Everest. Also pretty much everything is hardwired because of this workflow, meaning that in order to change something in the game, it needs all original data paths and source files a.k.a. Channels. If anything is missing = no proper working editor/engine. Considering Nautis is based on this same engine and code, I'm unfortunately pretty sure we'll never get our hands on open source material. Even if they released it, try to find a free working copy of Questviewer somewhere. And if you do, who's going to teach you. There are no tutorials, no resources, no one else who knows the software, and the user interface is anything but self explanatory unlike Unreal Engine or Unity which has a friendly toolset and a massive community behind it. Even within the doors of VSTEP I had trouble not accidentally breaking the game. You can better invest your time in those engines.
The software is also fully Direct X based, which isn't compatible with Mac OSX framework. Mac only supports Open GL applications which is a completely different programming library.

Had this game been done in one of the former mentioned engines, we would have been in luck.
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25508 on: April 13, 2016, 20:14:25 »

During my efforts to get modding capabilities into ShipSim, I worked with Questviewer a few times. It's a really obscure development kit with barely any resources and it has a learning curve steeper than the back of Mount Everest. Also pretty much everything is hardwired because of this workflow, meaning that in order to change something in the game, it needs all original data paths and source files a.k.a. Channels. If anything is missing = no proper working editor/engine. Considering Nautis is based on this same engine and code, I'm unfortunately pretty sure we'll never get our hands on open source material. Even if they released it, try to find a free working copy of Questviewer somewhere. And if you do, who's going to teach you. There are no tutorials, no resources, no one else who knows the software, and the user interface is anything but self explanatory unlike Unreal Engine or Unity which has a friendly toolset and a massive community behind it. Even within the doors of VSTEP I had trouble not accidentally breaking the game. You can better invest your time in those engines.
The software is also fully Direct X based, which isn't compatible with Mac OSX framework. Mac only supports Open GL applications which is a completely different programming library.

Had this game been done in one of the former mentioned engines, we would have been in luck.

Why has VSTEP used such a strange engine?.... Not even google brings up the people who make it.
This is like Working for Stena Line again trying to get the check in system to work better BUT no manual.
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Captain Cadet
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Mr Robville

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25509 on: April 14, 2016, 08:11:54 »

The engine was developed by Act 3D. I believe some employees at VSTEP from the management side used to work there, so the integration of Quest3D pretty much went automatically if I recall correctly. But I think they also wanted to prevent the exact thing I've mentioned in my last sentence, that people would tamper with their code. The more obscure an engine is, the less likely there's a chance that competitors may dig up code or reverse engineer it. And it worked.
Professional wise I fully understand this decision since it's a dirty world we live in and people go great lengths to rip someone off for their own profit. Gameplay wise though, it's terrible since the game's expiration date has been signed from the day it releases.
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Dannypenguin

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25510 on: April 14, 2016, 12:37:23 »

Do you know if many other games use the Quest engine?
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25511 on: April 14, 2016, 22:29:54 »

The engine was developed by Act 3D. I believe some employees at VSTEP from the management side used to work there, so the integration of Quest3D pretty much went automatically if I recall correctly. But I think they also wanted to prevent the exact thing I've mentioned in my last sentence, that people would tamper with their code. The more obscure an engine is, the less likely there's a chance that competitors may dig up code or reverse engineer it. And it worked.
Professional wise I fully understand this decision since it's a dirty world we live in and people go great lengths to rip someone off for their own profit. Gameplay wise though, it's terrible since the game's expiration date has been signed from the day it releases.

Problem is that not the game is more or less dead, hate to say that but it is. What it could really do with is community involvement which we wanted for years! I agree that businesses want to hide their code in the software useful life there is no point of us being able to play with it anymore - Nautilus is years ahead (I recently saw a live preview of Rescue3D and it was impressive). I get VSTEP dont want ship sim to get close to it, we can go and make it how we want it to be and possibly have saved it.
Also looking at how many ship simulators have been made, there is likely to be a low chance of someone wanting to reverse engineer it.

I did look into Quest3D and I found it to be, weird...  € 2,999. to € 9,999 licence is expensive for starters - That is a lot of money when you have tools like Unity that can do the job for a lot less - plus you have support. Quest3D hasn't been updated since 2012 Which means its almost 4 years old - Why should a company like VSTEP still be using something that a company hasn't brought new things out for 4 years?
Yes it might be good enough now but its not having the same release cycle as things like unity and that its not open source so there isn't a community behind it.
Unity is fine as its got big companies like Microsoft, Intel, Samsung working on them and it will stay relevant.
Open source software can keep going thanks to their community - someone will always maintain software while it got a use (look at SUCS Miliways - still having people working on in 20 years on (its the university old chat system).

But being a small piece of software which is closed off and is closed source which VSTEP still seem to be relying on in the new tools is a dangerous situations for them to be on - Just look at their forum, most posts haven't been touched since August 2015 - 7 months ago

Ok I guess I see things differently from how VSTEP want to go and thats probably my chances of ever getting a job at VSTEP gone in that rant and I know top management arnt going to give a darn about one upset customer from the product they don't support anymore but I wanted to vent myself...

If this is the company you were on about (they use to be known as act3d): https://lumion3d.com/contact.html
They seem to like high prices but seem to be interested in making models look pretty...

Do you know if many other games use the Quest engine?
1 or 2 other games: heres a link to all the samples - most of the people use it are for non customer products such as concepts.
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Captain Cadet
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Mr Robville

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25512 on: April 15, 2016, 09:25:37 »

I know AudioSurf also used Quest 3D, but that's pretty much it.
The high prices you're seeing is still the old business model that's very obsolete nowadays. Unreal Engine and Unity used to be quite expensive as well before the "Engine war" started. Still though, they provided easy access to newcomers. Unless a developer specifically wants an obscure engine, there's absolutely nothing Quest3D offers compared to the latest technology. Just Google some images of Unreal Engine, Unity or CryEngine. All you see is usually tech demo's and fancy graphics etc. If you Google Questviewer, you only get error messages.  :doh:
If I remember correctly, there's not even a Ctrl + Z undo function in the SDK since the interface is developed under the premise of "just do it properly in one go", which I find absolutely astounding considering software development is pretty much 75% trial and error...

But I think that Act3D is now only focused on Lumion as their flagship software. There's no use for them to market Quest3D due to the many better alternatives.

Although I can't disclose what Engine or other details, VSTEP has been starting to utilize a new modern engine. From what I've seen last, is probably the most impressive ocean I've ever seen in a game engine. And I've seen many. At one point I almost mistook it for real footage. Before the hype flies, no this ain't a new ShipSim sequel and I can't go into it more than that.

Oh and don't worry, I was an annoying brat when I joined this forum. The last thing I would have expected back then was becoming an admin of the place and working for them when I did. Still though, I would slap some manners in my former self if I could.  :P
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25513 on: April 16, 2016, 18:16:05 »

No Control Z - Someone didnt bother going to the Human Device Interaction lectures (It's really about how many mistakes people do when use computers).

I guess I'm looking at older technology and I didnt realise that a huge amount had changed since 2012... But I'm glad to see VSTEP has actually moved on as computers have moved on. Though I was having a debate with someone yesterday who looks into computing usage that Windows will not be the OS of the future as free software picks up, the coming death of windows 7 and that a good chunk of computers still use Windows XP, and that variants of Linux will be used as we're seeing with android laptops and chrome books...

Though I wonder what VSTEP are working on now - with water that realistic... Flight simulator?

Quote
Oh and don't worry, I was an annoying brat when I joined this forum. The last thing I would have expected back then was becoming an admin of the place and working for them when I did. Still though, I would slap some manners in my former self if I could.

I still cringe looking at my posts from a few years back so your not the only one.

Also 75% failure rate - I recon is about 85%  :doh:


 
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Captain Cadet
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danny

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25514 on: May 05, 2016, 12:00:52 »

. - - / . . . . / . / . - . / . // . . / . . . // . / . . . - / . / . - . / - . - - / - - - / - . / . // . . - - . . //
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Seagoing officer, with experience on PSV's, CSV's, DSV's and anchor handlers.
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Dannypenguin

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25515 on: May 05, 2016, 12:58:44 »

Danny, are you alright?  :doh:
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Agent|Austin

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25516 on: May 07, 2016, 22:12:38 »

So weird seeing familiar faces from so many years ago. It was a great time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZb_-j7vReU
« Last Edit: May 08, 2016, 08:37:53 by Agent|Austin »
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25517 on: May 08, 2016, 21:14:05 »

I know we've all came back to pay our respects  :P
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Captain Cadet
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25518 on: May 17, 2016, 00:32:47 »

Is there any reason why theres a cake in my profile?  :evil:
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Captain Cadet
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Dannypenguin

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25519 on: May 17, 2016, 09:56:21 »

Happy Birthday...? ;D
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The Ferry King

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25520 on: May 17, 2016, 09:58:32 »

Happy Birthday!  ;D
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25521 on: May 17, 2016, 23:13:11 »

Thank you! Its annoying that May is exam season here in the UK and I'm doing a degree in Computer Science at the moment (I might have forgotten to say)  and I have an Advance Programming Exam tomorrow!
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Captain Cadet
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The Ferry Man

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25522 on: May 23, 2016, 18:02:41 »

Oh how I so don't miss exams...

Dannypenguin

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25523 on: May 24, 2016, 08:55:12 »

Testing times huh?  ;)
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Captain Cadet

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Re: The Cookie Box MkII - On stranger tides
« Reply #25524 on: May 26, 2016, 13:20:00 »

Yes, I said last year I would never do exams again, then I ended up in univesity...

Oh how I so don't miss exams...
I cannot wait to have that feeling
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Captain Cadet
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