Mastering the dreaded azimuth

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[kuusuru]

I find it nigh on impossible to operate the azimuth control, so I normally avoid it entirely.  Today I hopped into a Bugsier for the first time - shock!  horror! for she has naught but azimuth steering.  Needless to say, I zigzagged my way across the harbour until, mercifully, my Internet connection gave out.

So what is the secret?  The control seems incredibly sensitive to mouse operation - as soon as I click on it, it often spins through at least 180 degrees.  Operating one control is challenging enough - how on earth does anyone manage to operate the Bugsier?  Do I need additional hardware?  A couple of USB joysticks?  Better hand/eye co-ordination?  Less beer?  More beer?  Different beer, maybe that's the solution...

[Shipaddict]

First of all, I don't know how many people who have problems with steering Ocean Star and Bugsier do this, but make sure Precision Steering is on

Settings > Control > Precision Steering

This will hopefully help a great deal, I also think someone made a guide, i'll try and find it

Hope this helps,

SA

[Shipaddict]

Ok, this is a little tutorial on some manouveres of Bugsier, by Bottman

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wUYGvnBwRZc

EDIT:
Some stuff by mvsmith:

http://www.shipsim.com/ShipSimForum/index.php/topic,4665.msg47406.html#msg47406
http://www.shipsim.com/ShipSimForum/index.php/topic,9012.msg104382.html#msg104382
http://www.shipsim.com/ShipSimForum/index.php/topic,9012.msg104399.html#msg104399

These are for Ocean Star, but its practically the same for Bugsier
If I find anything else, i'll update this post

[kuusuru]

First of all, I don't know how many people who have problems with steering Ocean Star and Bugsier do this, but make sure Precision Steering is on

Settings > Control > Precision Steering

This will hopefully help a great deal, I also think someone made a guide, i'll try and find it

Hope this helps,

SA

Thanks!!!!!  I went back in and had a look at the control settings - Precision Steering was unchecked (I normally don't use the keyboard controls) but "Azimuth arcade steering override" was checked, and this seems to be the culprit.  With this enabled, the vessel is uncontrollable by the keyboard, to me anyway - the screws point 90 or 270, nothing else.  Unchecked, it's much the same as any other, and you're right, precision steering seems particularly suited to azimuth operation.

Cheers for the great info and prompt response 

[Shipaddict]

Ah good, you found the problem

My pleasure

[Loudspeaker]

I avoided it too, but then I learned how to reset the controls using the keyboard, and now I have a great time with both the Bugsier and the Ocean Star. When close to my target, I manouvre by using only the throttle on both engines. I can't control the fast passenger craft, though, but I guess I will just need to take the time to get accustomed to it.

[pigdog]

More beer is a good start.

It nulls the pain of trying to control the Bugsier 2 without the slightest bit of realism in the controls.

[Cob]

I find it nigh on impossible to operate the azimuth control, so I normally avoid it entirely.  Today I hopped into a Bugsier for the first time - shock!  horror! for she has naught but azimuth steering.  Needless to say, I zigzagged my way across the harbour until, mercifully, my Internet connection gave out.

So what is the secret?  The control seems incredibly sensitive to mouse operation - as soon as I click on it, it often spins through at least 180 degrees.  Operating one control is challenging enough - how on earth does anyone manage to operate the Bugsier?  Do I need additional hardware?  A couple of USB joysticks?  Better hand/eye co-ordination?  Less beer?  More beer?  Different beer, maybe that's the solution...

Hello! A Council useful to maneuver WITH THE PROPULSION azimuth. In my view and best not to use the mouse if you do not have a certain practicality as this is very sensitive. The bugsier 2 the manovro easily using the keyboard, initially will take a little bit of practicality special way with the reaction times from bike forward to ago. In Ocean star commands on the rudder act on the contrary to the bugsier 2.
bugsier in 2 simply set rudder 1 and Pole 2 in keyboard enter By choosing to pleasure the keys that are more easily manageable, for example in my PC.
I preferred this configuration: rudder 1
left "7" right "9" Reset "8";
rudder 2 left "?" right "back space" Reset " ' ";
As regards the power of the individual motors use the numeric keyboard:
left increases "7" reduce "1" Reset "4";
right increases "9" reduce "3" Reset "6";
all remains subjective, each of us chooses as more remains comfortable maneuver.
Good work in all
regards Cobra 

[kuusuru]

Thanks guys , that's all helpful.  I've been controlling them together on the keyboard, and it works OK - but I'll try mapping each one to a different set of keys.

[firestar12]

I personally, LOVE the azipods. Most cruise ships today use them. You can reverse without stopping the ship.

[kuusuru]

You can reverse without stopping the ship.

Can you explain this further?  I'm not an expert in ship handling (virtual or otherwise) but it seems to me that if you are transitioning from forward motion to reverse motion there must be a moment, however fleeting, where the vessel is for all intents and purposes dead in the water  . 

[firestar12]

Can you explain this further?  I'm not an expert in ship handling (virtual or otherwise) but it seems to me that if you are transitioning from forward motion to reverse motion there must be a moment, however fleeting, where the vessel is for all intents and purposes dead in the water  . 

It means you don't need to slow down, and wait for the ship to stop before you throw her in reverse.

[mvsmith]

It means you don't need to slow down, and wait for the ship to stop before you throw her in reverse.

If you throw any other type into reverse without stopping, you could wreck the tranny, snap a U-joint, or wear a flat spot on the tyres.

The easiest way to control both Bug2 and OS is with the mouse.
I hear the argument "but you can't operate both controls at the same time"—you don't need to.
I hear the argument "that is not a realistic way"—of course I understand that the real ships are always driven with a keyboard.

[firestar12]

If you throw any other type into reverse without stopping, you could wreck the tranny, snap a U-joint, or wear a flat spot on the tyres.

The easiest way to control both Bug2 and OS is with the mouse.
I hear the argument "but you can't operate both controls at the same time"—you don't need to.
I hear the argument "that is not a realistic way"—of course I understand that the real ships are always driven with a keyboard.

I couldn't have said it better. I wish they had an option though were the other one mimicked the action the other one did. That way, it would be like having two hands.

[*M*A*S*]

Are there USB controllers that look like azimuth throttles that would work with ship sim?

[firestar12]

Are there USB controllers that look like azimuth throttles that would work with ship sim?

A regular joystick works for me, I suppose if you found one it might work.

[mvsmith]

The basic problem in using game-type joysticks is that they—and the Windows joystick interface—work in Cartesian coordinates. The actual joysticks on vessels work in polar coordinates.
With practice, one can control both drives with the mouse—with less than a second delay between them. For small course corrections, it is not necessary to change both drives. The up-arrow key will quickly restore the drives to amidships.

Another problem is that most joysticks have spring-return that cannot be defeated. Or, if it can they lack enough friction to stay put. A force-feedback stick with the motor unplugged comes close.

[*M*A*S*]

Well I was doing further surfing on the web for the controllers and found that there are about 2 types that are compatible with ship simulator. Only set back is that there are no control to simulate the azipods.   

[pigdog]

You can always build your own like some of us have done, the way in which the game allows inputs for azimuth controls to allow 360 degree turnning is a bit strange, if it were like the Red eagle then it would be fine. I can use my home made azimuth controls on the red eagle and they work very well.

Check this out.
http://www.shipsim.com/ShipSimForum/index.php/topic,4505.0/topicseen.html

[*M*A*S*]

Hey pigdog that a real awesome control throttle set up you got there especially the azipods.  Wish I could buy one just like that.  Or if they sold something similar.  I'll try my luck to see if I can make one.   

[firestar12]

You can always build your own like some of us have done, the way in which the game allows inputs for azimuth controls to allow 360 degree turnning is a bit strange, if it were like the Red eagle then it would be fine. I can use my home made azimuth controls on the red eagle and they work very well.

Check this out.
http://www.shipsim.com/ShipSimForum/index.php/topic,4505.0/topicseen.html

Wow! I would do just about anything for a set of those! You should sell them.

[*M*A*S*]

Guess you have potential for marketing pigdog    I would definitely buy one if you were selling

[pigdog]

It's taken a bit of time to get it right and working correctly not to mention the time it's taken for the ends of my fingers to heal after soldering them together, Lol. I shouldn't have fingers like sausages I suppose.
It still doesn't work correctly with the azimuth ships though due to the way the azimuth controls are implimented in the sim but those of us who have built azimuth controls are hoping that this will change with the next release of ss otherwise we will have to go back to the drawing board.

As I said previously it works fine with the Red Eagle which is a bit strange as in real life her steering doesn't turn 360 degrees where as an azimuth driven vessel will turn 360 degrees but is very restricted in the game if your using anything but the keyboard and precission steering.

There is quite a bit of info on how to build your own controls dotted around the forum with links to places where you can buy the key parts and it's really not that difficult to do, I didn't have a clue before I started I would give it a go it's enjoyable to do too.

Pigdog