How to manouver a boat/ship/canoe

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

[Karbine]

This is not my experience.  The technique works with all the vessels in 06 -- of course the amount of throttle vs. the amount of thruster has to be adjusted to the circumstances (eg. different ships, onshore wind, etc).

Cheers,
Michael

Totally right,the bigger vessels are just slower to manouver with this.  If you have the Single engine vessels such as the container ships in SS06 you change it slightly.

You put your bowthruster on just a tad and you put your rudder (Wheel) into wherever you are coming away from, you then give it splashes in ahead and astern to bring yourself off.   If your head (bow) is coming away too fast you can switch it off,then back on,then off and so on.

In real life where i work on the River Thames in London, we have different tides,either Ebb (Flowing out of london) or Flood (flooding into London).  With single screw passenger boats that i sometimes operate, we use the tide to do the work for you.

You can put your wheel out away from the pier and give it a little splash Ahead which brings your head (bow) out away from the pier. You then knock it into nutral gear and let the tide get inside the head(bow) and push the boat away.

Then again the game still has many improvements to meet real life movements but i feel its pretty realistic.

Hope this helps

[Eemspoort]

Eemspoort,

You may well be right in what you say. (I haven't finished my flying lessons yet... ) so maybe I find flying simple because I have experience.

Since Groeenegaard has explained the physics of manouvering- from a 'real world' perspective, it all makes total sense. However, flying a airplane is still very easy. Admittedly, I am talking about a single engined Slingsby Firefly and not an A380!

Put this way- 50 hours and you can be qualified with a pilots licence (single engined, VFR only/ non instrument). I think it takes more than 50 hours to qualify as a ship captain...

Stu

Yep, your right! I don't know what the qualifications are for see-going captains, but for inland vessels you need a minimum of (i thought) 4 years of "sailing-time". This means, 4 times 180 days in your "Dienstboekje". That is a personal log for entering your sail-days. However, this has nothing to do with actually sailing/pilotting a vessel!
Offcourse you need to go to school for getting your "schippers-diploma" (inland-captain-diploma?). If you have this diploma, and the apropriate sail-time, you can pick up your "Groot-Vaarbewijs" (drivers-license for inland-ships).
So, you don't need any practical exames what so ever! Strange, huh... I've meated people how had there "drivers-license", and wanted to get there Radar-diploma, and didn't know what to do with the radar-simulator! They couldn't pilot a vessel!!! So the teacher (how teached me on school, so i knew the guy  ) asked me if i could give those fellas a speed-cousre in piloting a vessel! That was a great laugh, offcourse, however i don't like to meat them on the waters in the fog... Allthough, they did get there Radar-diplomas, so i must have done something good there.

I myself took the long road. I have been to school for a total of 7 years, this was all related to inland-shipping.
Because of this, i had several points i didn't had to graduate on for my Skipper-diploma and "drivers-license".
But i had more advantages counting for me, because i was born and raised on inland-ships.

Now i have all my papers, accept for one. I don't have the "Rijn-patent" (drivers-license for sailing the Rhine), so i cant sail the Rhine without a Pilot. This is a highly questionable peice of paper, since there are much more difficult rivers to sail. Oh well, that's not interesting for this thread.

But! If you only want to sail a ship smaller then 20 meters, and/or slower then 13 km/h, you need the "Klein-Vaarbweijs" (drivers-license for Small Ships). This is a peice of paper, easy to get for most people.

So it's kinda like flying planes. If you only want to fly a Cessna, for instance, you are on the right way with your lessons.
But if you whant to fly the A380, that's a totally different kind of cake! You'll need more and other lessons to take, before you have the apropriate papers and qualifications to fly that kind of giants.

Hope this answers some questions.

[alazose]

For handling powerboats, I recommend "Chapman Piloting and Seamanship, 64th Edition", by Elbert S. Maloney, 928 pages  (available at Amazon for $21.85 USD).  For handling of larger ships, I recommend Maine Maritime Academy, or Annapolis, or Ship Simulator 2008.

[Cloud]

I recommend Maine Maritime Academy, or Annapolis, or Ship Simulator 2008.

Oh Gosh!....don't get the US Navy involved in ship handling!...sorry it's just too easy of a target 

groennegaard nice posts. This is so far my favorite berth, too bad the wind doesn't affect the vessels and there's no current to make it really interesting.   

ps - no offense to any navy guys here...just some good spirited fun 

 

[Agent|Austin]

When I was doing this in SS08 I put my bow thruster starboard. I keep the line on my starboard bow connected and then port prop ahead and the starboard prop astern to get as much force to turn it starboard as I can and then once I am about 3/4 there I let the mooring line out and put both props ahead and rudders starboard...

Confusing but yes

[Sailor.Bob]

I made a little step by step movie. if requested i can make one with how to with 1 propeller and bow thrusters, 2 propellers and no bow thruster.
 

HEres the movie: http://youtube.com/watch?v=TQL3ij8ogXc

[Captain Kool]

I too find flying simple, I've only flown in a professional simulator, not a real aircraft.

[Britannic]

I hope the picture below will help answer the question above as to how a short burst of ahead power can be used to turn the vessel, without gathering significant headway. 

The majority of large conventional ferries built today have what are variously known as Hi-lift or Becker rudders etc, and these have a large primary rudder , onto the trailing edge of which is attached a secondary surface, a 'tab' of sorts.  Any rudder angle setting ordered is duplicated by BOTH the primary and secondary surfaces - ie. setting 20degrees of helm will move the main surface to that angle, and the trailing tab will then move 20degrees relative to the main surface, effectively giving 40degrees of helm.  The ferries with which I am familiar have a rudder limit of 45degrees, effectively enabling thrust from the propeller to be vectored through 90degrees, thus having maximum turning effect with very little ahead movement.

Having possibly confused you with that 'description' I will let this photo do the rest of the explaining - it is of Irish Ferries' Ulysses when she was last in drydock, and it shows her rudders hard over to port.  Imagine if you were standing directly astern of the prop (apologies for not having a photo to illustrate this!), you would in actual fact see only the tips of the blades, as the rudder diverts the vast majority of all thrust to the port side.

Hence, you can see why stern thrusters are less common than bow thrusters, simply because a similar job can be done with the equipment already in place, and it saves on the purchase and fitting of expensive thrusters!

I hope that has answered more questions than it has thrown up, but feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer them and find a photo to illustrate. 

Wonderful Pic!  My apoligies if you already said this, but are those blades variable pitch? (Im a bit of a thikee when it comes to this kinda thing!  )

[Stuart2007]

I like that picture. I've always wanted to go in a dry dock under the hull of a ship (PREFERABLY whilst it hasn't got any water in it...) just to get a real sense of scale of a ship up close. You don't get the sense of scale when it's sitting in the water.

I don't suppose there's a dockyard manager here is there?

Stu

[LucAtC]

The propellers have indeed variable pitch, you can identify it easily at the hub, the roots of the blades that can rotate, and that the pitch is at or close to zero on the picture.
Also, you can see that the two propellers are "supra convergents, ie in forward the port screw is right handed, the starboard one left handed.
Regards,
Luc

[Britannic]

Thanks for that, Luc! Ill know what to look out for in future! 

Thanks, Sky

[Agent|Austin]

Just to clear things up. On my post earlier I meant my stern mooring line not my bow...

Agent ^_^

[Len2480]

Not to sure about commercial ships,but on naval vessels(UK) to get the stern out ,one would put a line (Spring)out from close to the bow to a bollard on the jetty about midships,and go ahead (slow).making sure you had tons of fenders on the foc;sle.likewise to get the bow out one would reverse the procedure from the quarterdeck..With all the modern technology I guess they don;t do it any more.Also of interest back in the forties they had motor boats fitted with what was known as Kitchener gear..which consisted of two buckets? either side of the prop which could be opened or closed completely,with the engine at constant full revs,just by altering the buckets from full open to fully closed you could go at any speed and astern (buckets closed) Hope this is of interest or maybe jog some memories L. Djx 846502.

[Stuart2007]

Interesting. Is that for all sizes of ships? I've seen Warships docking in Portsmouth and they use a military tug to dock and when departing.

Admittedly I haven't seen many so maybe It's just been coincidence. I remember seeing the Ark Royal docking with 3 tugs. Don't think they'd manouver THAT my tieing lines to the bow

Stu

[Len2480]

No I don;t think it applied to the larger ships mainly destroyers and frigates and smaller.L

[Stuart2007]

That really surprises me. I know a modern destroyer/frigate isn't as heavy as the older ships of days gone by, but even then, the stress on the ship as it pivots round must be enormous.

Navy cutbacks...

Stu

[[RWP]DJM]

I've been watching this topic for a while now

The only boat (if you can really call it a boat) that I can pilot is a Canoe   Not the best vessel in the world, but great fun

[groennegaard]

"drive a boat..."  That would never have come out of my mouth...    That is the truth even though the topic has my name on it... 

Regards
groennegaard

[Stuart2007]

Ah but come on DJM. Don't be modest. Is that an ocean going canoe?

Stu

[[RWP]DJM]

"drive a boat..."  That would never have come out of my mouth...    That is the truth even though the topic has my name on it... 

Regards
groennegaard

LOL, I should have maybe said 'paddle' a Canoe......hmm, typo's eh

[[RWP]DJM]

Ah but come on DJM. Don't be modest. Is that an ocean going canoe?

Stu

ROFL, I wouldn't wanna try that out, it was bad enough on a river/weir

[Stuart2007]

"drive a boat..."  That would never have come out of my mouth...    That is the truth even though the topic has my name on it... 

Regards
groennegaard

No, sorry... When the topic was split from the original P&O berth topic, your's was the first post so it automatically assigned your name.

It's just a phrase. I talk about driving my airplane, as jus slang talk for convenience. Sorry if that offends your professional etiquette I shall see if it can be changed.

Stu

[Stuart2007]

ROFL, I wouldn't wanna try that out, it was bad enough on a river/weir

I had to laugh up the canal a few weeks back, this couple on a 40ft narrow boat were playing at ships. "helm 2 degrees to port dear"... "stand by on bow thruster dear..." "prepare forward mooring line dear"... Good God it was a CANAL barge not the QM2

You should have heard them they were SO serious. Bless.

Stu

EDIT: Title changed in menu... Now reads 'how to MANOUVER a boat/ship/canoe'

Hope you like the canoe reference DJM

[[RWP]DJM]

I had to laugh up the canal a few weeks back, this couple on a 40ft narrow boat were playing at ships. "helm 2 degrees to port dear"... "stand by on bow thruster dear..." "prepare forward mooring line dear"... Good God it was a CANAL barge not the QM2

You should have heard them they were SO serious. Bless.

Stu

EDIT: Title changed in menu... Now reads 'how to MANOUVER a boat/ship/canoe'

Hope you like the canoe reference DJM

LOL @ Canoe reference

To be honest, if I ever sailed a 'proper' vessel, I would most likely avoid nautical terms

I'd be like 'Left a bit, right a bit, straighten her up.....BANG!!' 

[groennegaard]

No, sorry... When the topic was split from the original P&O berth topic, your's was the first post so it automatically assigned your name.

It's just a phrase. I talk about driving my airplane, as jus slang talk for convenience. Sorry if that offends your professional etiquette I shall see if it can be changed.

LOL   It would take a lot more to offend me but thanks anyway...  

Regards
groennegaard