Ship Simulator
English forum => Ship Simulator Extremes => Topic started by: JOHN LYLE on August 24, 2010, 15:39:03
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I have been looking ath the demo videos of the GreenPeace missions and I don't thing you will win over many professional seafarers here. It seem to be missions against mercahnt ships for dumping garbage and oil. While I will agree that this does happen those that do it are in the minority. You end up giving the impression that ships are responsible for all the pollution at sea. If land based polluters had reduced their pollution of the sea as much as the marine industry has since 1990 we would be seeing a significant improvement of the world oceans. How many people are aware that pleasure boats in Nort America release enough oil into the water to equal 15 Exxon valdez oil spills.
Secondly it is legal for ships to dump garbage as long as it is not oil or plastic and is dumped more than 25 miles off shore. In the last 10 years all the shipping companies I have worked for have a zero discharge policy as far as dumping garbage goes. We were still allowed to dump food waste over the side but that is all. The rest was retained on board for disposal ashore or burned in an incinerator and the ash disposed of ashore.
So how about stop making merchant ships the baad guys and stop "teaching" people terrorist tactics by letting them attack merchant ships.
The next professional seafarer I meet that is for Green Peace and the Sea Shepard Soceity will be the first. I am sure there must be some out there but I have not met one yet.
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Who ever said anything about attacking?
The most violent actions I can see on these missions is shooting... with a camera.
There's no ramming etc. Just taking photos.
All the missions are based on real life events with the same ships, for anyone who isn't in touch with the environment that much then maybe they can learn a thing or two about somethings that do really go in the world.
Sure there's polluters on land too but this is just a maritime game so it's only at sea.
Even if it's a small thing people still enjoy the feeling that they are helping the environment, and with this game they can actually feel that a bit.
But if you don't like the look of the game there's no obligation to buy.
But in general overall what I'm saying is that there are definately more people excited about these missions than people that despise them.
The companies that make this game have spent a lot of hard work on these games, and if somebody says something bad about the product then it isn't so nice for the creators they feel sad in a way maybe that people don't enjoy the game.
And if people keep posting negative comments about the game it doesn't look good overall :-\ The people on this forum are friendly people in a close knit-community who all enjoy the game.
So please just if you have any negative comments keep them for yourself and feel free to post any positive things. It's just nice at the end of the day to keep a nice atmosphere here :thumbs:
I hope you understand :)
I say it in a friendly way!
Kind Regards
Matthew
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Matthew put what I wanted to write in a much better way.
Just wanted to point out that you can clearly see land during the Vermaas scene (dumping cargo ship), she's not out at sea there.
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Matt,
If we let you voice your Sea Shepard propaganda here on many occasions, then John is entitled to his opinion too.
Negative or positive, doesn't matter. He has a valid point and some real mariners will probably prefer the other missions, and not the GP ones, altough the picture he paints is not what Vstep have in mind with the GP missions at all, but still, no need to tell him to not post his opinion. He can. Same as you can, when you post unsubstantiated Sea Shepard propaganda here.
But it's giving and taking.
So John, Vstep really doesn't want to give the impression you think it will give with this GP part of the game. But I can see how you might come to such a conclusion. I think it's not to be taken THAT seriusly though, since after all, it is a game. :-\
Regards,
Fred
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Yes exactly :thumbs:
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I am mostly in agreement with John on this one. There are ships which break the rules, but they are few and far between.
The shipping industry is legislated to the point where seafarers can go to jail for accidental discharges of oil into the sea whereas shore based industries get comparatively minor fines for intentional discharges. Ships are required by law to separate garbage into 7 different categories, ports are required to provide reception facilities for all of these different categories (a cost which is passed on to ship operators), yet when these seven categories of garbage are collected they go in the back of one truck and get taken to the same dump.
Legislation has been in place for the past 20 years stating that ships must filter all bilge water to a maximum of 15 parts oil per million parts of water, technology has only just made this practically possible in the last few years, while pleasure craft continue to pump oil overboard with impunity and oil continues to leak into the sea from the Earth's crust.
Organisations like Greenpeace and Sea Shepherd have been the driving force behind the criminalisation of seafarers and for VStep to reinforce the erroneous negative images pedalled by people like these is disappointing especially in a game such as ship simulator.
Shipping is in fact one of the "greenest" forms of transport available and rather than constantly making scapegoats out of the shipping industry organisations such as Greenpeace should be encouraging sea trade as a better alternative to road haulage and air freight.
I would be interested to see what would happen if some of the idiotic and irresponsible actions of Sea Shepherd in particular were to cause pollution.
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Like in many other fields, those (most of the sailors, I hope) who act responsibly have to pay for the few who didn't respect the rules. That's how things works, everybody pay for the behaviours of few.
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Informed opinions of individuals actually from within the profession work so much better for me than the emotionalistic opinions of conservationists. ::)
No offense, their hearts are in the right place, for the most part, specially with the younger population, but a little real research instead of believing what one sees in a hugely biassed TV show, for example, just works much better.
I don't fully agree that GP should have been left out on the whole, but I'm indifferent to it I reckon. I can't say I prefer it, but I also don't mind. After all, environmentalism sells too. And there's enough fans of the GP/SS things that will like it. And a lot of their work is commendable, too. It's not all bad, or at least, wasn't.. always. (At least with GP)
But.. before we get a standard response here, I'd like to ask the 'other side' to also do the homework first, so we don't get yet another mudslinging incident here, like with all of these topics so far.. :)
Thanks everyone. :thumbs:
Regards,
Fred
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I agree with the Sea Shepard putting a lot at risk with their actions, but they are primarily an anti-whaling group, not an environmental group - they repeatedly state that their common dream is to see the whaling ships head for the bottom of the sea, clearly an environmental disaster. Especially down on the vulnerable antarctic coast.
I personally was never under the impression that the modern shipping industry as a whole appeared to have such a bad public image? It is surely not the case here in Norway, a nation that greatly rely on shipping.
When a bad apple is found, however, should it not be dealt with? Would it be better to look the other way and say that all is good? The way I see it, is (in this case greenpeace, but on other occations other organisations, either governmental or private) someone documenting an illegal act so that the 'bad apple' can be taken out of the basket. If anything, they are making sure the great reputation of shipping is maintained by sorting out the bad seeds.
Are there any specific events where either Greenpeace or SS attacked seafarers as a whole?
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The way I see it, is (in this case greenpeace, but on other occations other organisations, either governmental or private) someone documenting an illegal act so that the 'bad apple' can be taken out of the basket.
Yes I agree, if they can gather the evidence to let the proper authorities step in and handle it, then more power to them!!
If they play judge, jury and executioner by attacking ships, clearly not within their jurisdiction, then they become part of the problem.
I always wonder if Sea Shepard fans that yell 'they should all be sunk' can imagine having a loved one work as a sailor on the ship to be sunk, just trying to make a living in a hard-knock economy, and if the are willing to sacrifice their loved one to save a fish.. (I know it's a mammal, but it went back into the ocean itself, so it's a fish by choice) ;)
Fred.
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Very much agree with you, both the part with observation versus taking the role of judge, jury and hangman, and the the wishing of ill faiths towards the crew of ships.
Oh, and a lol at the whalefish :doh:
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I for one sincerely don't want to see any whaling ships sunk. That would be horrible!
And I know SSCS would not sink a ship out at sea at all, as Paul said that he would never dream of sinking a japanese ship or causing life threatening situations for the whalers. But he likes to make them think that they could do. So they have the upper hand.
Although it doesn't seem like that anymore, as when I was talking to the crew they said that their last campaign was a tough one as the whalers are stepping up in their violence. :-\
And believe me, If SSCS weren't there the government still wouldn't intervene. As they rightfully say, if the government wont do anything then someone has to. The problem is out at sea and they are tackling it straight on. Where as the governments stay on land, they only ever come out when absolutely necessary!
Hopefully one day the Australian government will come to their senses a bit more :thumbs:
And I think Greenpeace do a great job too, hopefully they too can return to the Antarctic one day :thumbs:
The more emphasis to stop the better.
Kind Regards
Matthew
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I agree with Matthew.
And besides we created this economy world that is ruining the planet.
I mean look around there is no real nature anymore. And the little things we got are threatenend by humans to make money out of it we always want more and that just have to stop.
And there are manny alternatives, That is what Greenpeace is standing for.
For the sailors, Greenpeace has good captains they never meant to ram ships.
Sea Shepherd is another story, They wil do anything to stop illegal proaching.
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And I know SSCS would not sink a ship out at sea at all, as Paul said that he would never dream of sinking a japanese ship or causing life threatening situations for the whalers. But he likes to make them think that they could do. So they have the upper hand.
How can a small fishing vessel sink a vastly bigger ship? Or even the RHIBS? Yes, cause the Ady Gil sure showed them by running straight into their path! Upper hand? How? ;)
Although it doesn't seem like that anymore, as when I was talking to the crew they said that their last campaign was a tough one as the whalers are stepping up in their violence. :-\
Biassed words of emotionalistic people that have exchanged reason for passion. Sure, it's scary when they throw flashbangs at you... but that's a justified response to the threat they pose to the whalers. They defend themselves with legally allowed non-lethal means. And even then, SS personell seems to get hurt on their own account much more than by the whalers, anyway. Or do you not notice the blunders as seen in the shows? (logic dictates there are other incidents even worse that they never will show too)
And believe me, If SSCS weren't there the government still wouldn't intervene. As they rightfully say, if the government wont do anything then someone has to. The problem is out at sea and they are tackling it straight on. Where as the governments stay on land, they only ever come out when absolutely necessary!
Maybe they don't because there is no actual law that's violated if they stick to their legally allowed quota in the waters that they arre allowed to operate it. SS likes to pretend they're not in that area, but they are.
And someone has to? That is not a valid arguement. So if I am not happy with how the police in my country handles criminals, I should go out and get a agun and hunt them down myself? Sorry, not how it works. Paul is a pirate/vigilante. And by the actions against the whalers, a criminal. Meaning well doesn't change the cold hard facts.
And oh.. you have't ever heard of the navy? The coast guard? They are ALWAYS out there. But they don't come to stop something that is not illegal, no matter how many times someone yells that it is.
Your case is flawed, sorry. And as long as all your information comes from only the one side, it will be.
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I don't think I'll comment on a topic like this again :doh:
Everyone is entitled to their opinion I suppose :thumbs:
I'm getting hungry for cookies so theres only one topic I can find that!
No hard feelings guys, it's never nice to have to talk like this :thumbdown:
Kind Regards
Matthew :)
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Are we still talkin about a GAME or is worldwar III on its way.???
People who are makin games follow a plan, it has nuttin to do with the real world, but this game shows that the makers like what greenpeace is doing. And thats good enough for me.
Rider
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I don't think Vstep is trying to say sailors are a bad bunch here. They just need to make the missions intresting or what would be the point of them and the ones that are based on real life events you have to ask how long ago did thease events take place it could of been quite afew years ago. And if your not a fan of thease missions well you just don't play them. :captain: As for SS V Whalers it's 6of1 half a dozen of the other both sides can be as bad as each other. An example of the whalers being bad is aiming that dish device at the SS copter trying to disable the pilot endangering a aircraft is quite a serious offence but then again so is ramming a ship somthing SS did.
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Guys,
These missions have been put there for a single reason - and that is for our enjoyment. Topics like this have been raised many many times before, but VSTEP are not trying to make anyone look bad here. They're creating a game so we can enjoy it, if you don't agree with the Greenpeace missions, then simply don't play them :)
Simples!
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I don't think I'll comment on a topic like this again :doh:
Everyone is entitled to their opinion I suppose :thumbs:
I'm getting hungry for cookies so theres only one topic I can find that!
No hard feelings guys, it's never nice to have to talk like this :thumbdown:
Kind Regards
Matthew :)
Just a friendly discussion from both sides mate, don't worry.
But you have to always look at it from both sides, and also take all the facts into account, hence me trying to balance some of the biassed stuff that you yourself, and other SSCS fans have written here on many occasions, as you cannot deny that some of it has been very edgy, in the past. And not very well informed.
But never wrote it with bad intentions towards you or the others. You just care for the environment and whales, and you mean well, I know that. There's no harm in that as such!! :thumbs:
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Just a friendly discussion from both sides mate, don't worry.
But you have to always look at it from both sides, and also take all the facts into account, hence me trying to balance some of the biassed stuff that you yourself, and other SSCS fans have written here on many occasions, as you cannot deny that some of it has been very edgy, in the past. And not very well informed.
But never wrote it with bad intentions towards you or the others. You just care for the environment and whales, and you mean well, I know that. There's no harm in that as such!! :thumbs:
aaahw freddy boy :lol:
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I'm kind of curious about the Greenpeace missions.. :)
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Guys,
These missions have been put there for a single reason - and that is for our enjoyment. Topics like this have been raised many many times before, but VSTEP are not trying to make anyone look bad here. They're creating a game so we can enjoy it, if you don't agree with the Greenpeace missions, then simply don't play them :)
Simples!
Well put.
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"if you don't agree with the Greenpeace missions, then simply don't play them "
I won't be playing them but I feel that they still give people the impression that merchant ships are the biggest polluters of the oceans. I have been accused of taking my "40 pieces of silver" many times because I work at sea for a living snd that is the exact words that have been used to me on more rthan one ocassion. I have seen some Green peace activists "try" to force a ship aground by blocking the main shipping channel of a harbour with rubber dinghies (now how stupid is that?). A few years ago some group blocked a chlorine carrier from going into Belfast because they disagreed with the cargo. That ship had only a fixed period of time to discharge the cargo before it would start to vent from the cargo tanks. It ended up going back to the load port, discharged the cargo, reloaded it and then back to Belfast at night so it could berth. These days seafarers can be fined and/or sent to jail for simple clerical errors in an Oil record book. I have seen it happen. The Sea Shepard ship Farley Mowat was impounded in Halifax Canada for pumping oily bilges into the harbour. The ship ended up being sold to pay the fine.
I am all for saving the environment but these people just jump on band wagons without doing their research first.
Yes VSTEP is developing a game that is fun to play but they should leave the politics out of it and the GP missions are a political statement. If they want to keep the GP missions then add a disclaimer that says that shipping is actually the greenest form of transport available.
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~Ciro's Two Cents~
1) While I agree with Greenpeace's ultimate aim, I DO NOT support some of their methods to attain them. However, I won't let that stop me from playing their missions in SSE because, frankly, the Esprenza (SP) and Rainbow Warrior 3 are beautiful ships.
2) I believe Sea Shepard goes a little overboard in their efforts. Again, I support them trying to stop illegally/over fishing whales. However, I cannot stand some of their tactics, such as ramming and aggressively attacking other ships or their crews.
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Guys, it's only a game.
While I think it's nice to have some Greenpeace vessels in SSE, I'm sure it was never the intention of Vstep to make a political statement by including Greenpeace vessels in the game.
I'm sure everyone at Vstep who worked very hard on SS2006, SS2008 and now SSE only have one goal in mind - to give everyone the enjoyment of playing a nautical simulation game and to try make it as real-life experience as possible. In that respect, I think Vstep certainly have achieved that.
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John,
Whilst a appreciate your thoughts on the matter (and is some respects agree with you) I do think you're over thinking this a little.
VSTEP have no intention of upsetting anyone whoever they are, and their intentions were certainly not political.
I can assure you that any missions that are in the game whether realted to the Navy class boats, greenpeace or otherwise the sole purpose of these missions is to have harmless enjoyment without the politics and hassle of a real-life situation.
Let's try and keep things above board here guys :)
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I joined this forum to discuss this.
I bought Railworks, cause I kind of like "boring" laid back simulators. I was excited to see that I could possibly sail freely on a large open ocean! WOW! that sounds fun! Driving a cargo ship in bad weather? GREAT!
Attack..."illegal" whalers? whao..whao...whao....what is illegal here? I have been researching for years now, and the Japanese people are breaking no laws at all. I dont want to open that discussion again, but encouraging violence against the Japanese people like GP, and SSCS do (Why are SSCS even mentioned? please do not give them any press!)
Captain Spencer. Your comment interests me. If the company did not want to upset people, then why did they choose to donate money too such an organization that is known for it's violence? it isn't political at all? I think it certainly is!
Why choose to attack the Japanese people over others to begin with? "harmless enjoyment" with out the politics and hassle of a real-life situation? People die at sea. It is very dangerous working there, yet they are paying, through licenses, and donations, the group to make people's lives and work at sea even more dangerous.
It infact scares me. What have I done to hurt the company? Why choose one race over another? Why attack one industry over another?
You claim it is "illegal" whaling, yet this is not true at all (I have researched it for years now). How is that not political to claim such a thing against a group of people, yet add nothing to back it up but politics?
I was looking forward to this game, but I fear I will not be buying it, as I do not want to support groups that attack innocent people on the open ocean!
EDIT: sorry for the bump. I didnt want to start a new discussion.
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Very nice discussion. I was expecting something like this in the Forum. Personally I think VStep chosen to introduce Green Peace here for advertising. Surely among the VStep staff will have people sympathetic with GP; very respectable, of course. But I think VStep saw, perhaps, a very easy way to attract more people. All of us know the fame of Green Peace. The TV news continuously talk about Green Peace. They are a referent nowadays.
But VStep was coming in a dangerous terrain too. This is a simulator for people in general, but, of course, the maritime community is specially represented in the forum, and many of them have another opinion about Green Peace, not so sweet. It`s a risky bet for VStep to introduce Green Peace here.
But the discussion introduces too here the question about the security in the sea. Is a new aspect to work by developers. Very interesting the rules about the anti-pollution devices on board. A new suggestion for VStep. I think in the positive side of the question.
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I received a reply from Vstep on this topic, and it seems what was discussed here is not true. They were very uninformed on the topic. It saddens me that they resorted to racial politics, and out right lies. They ignorantly said "hunting an almost extinct species". This is clearly either an outright lie, or they don't knwo the real facts.
The minke whale is no where near extinct.
http://www.iucnredlist.org/apps/redlist/details/2474/0
So why choose to portray the Japanese people as "poachers"? Why the lies? Why the hate?
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I received a reply from Vstep on this topic, and it seems what was discussed here is not true. They were very uninformed on the topic. It saddens me that they resorted to racial politics, and out right lies. They ignorantly said "hunting an almost extinct species". This is clearly either an outright lie, or they don't knwo the real facts.
The minke whale is no where near extinct.
http://www.iucnredlist.org/apps/redlist/details/2474/0
So why choose to portray the Japanese people as "poachers"? Why the lies? Why the hate?
You do realise there is more than one species of whale out there?
For example, Blue Whale is on the endangered list since 1986 due to commercial whaling. In fact from the same website which you provided a link of, it states that Blue Whale has been classed as 'Endangered' due to its population being plummeted by around 70% in the past 30 years. That is really bad news.
I do not wish to get into the "rights and wrongs" argument of whaling, but you do understand how people feel when there is evidence that some species of whale is under threat (while the others are not endangered, for example the Minkle whale) and why Greenpeace feel they have to intervene to prevent a total decimation of certain whale species - in this case the Blue Whale.
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I received a reply from Vstep on this topic, and it seems what was discussed here is not true. They were very uninformed on the topic. It saddens me that they resorted to racial politics, and out right lies. They ignorantly said "hunting an almost extinct species". This is clearly either an outright lie, or they don't knwo the real facts.
The minke whale is no where near extinct.
http://www.iucnredlist.org/apps/redlist/details/2474/0
So why choose to portray the Japanese people as "poachers"? Why the lies? Why the hate?
Hi matte225.
First of all, you're bringing a debate on "racial" aspects, which is totally irrelevant.
About the legal aspects you've "been searching for years", please read this :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Whaling_Commission
You may read this link, too :
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7188674.stm
An Australian court has ruled that the activities of the Japanese whaling fleet are illegal and ordered it to halt its operations.
And you can't deny the objectivity of those links. Unless you believe in a plot theory, and that the BBC is secretly a press office for greenpeace...
Even if you don't agree with the laws discussed aboved - which is your right - you're not allowed to blame anyone (especially VSTEP) for bringing "racial hate" inside what is nothing more than a Game. That is not tolerable on this forum.
And about the politics aspects you mention, I belive most game are undoubtfully much more debatable.
Sorry for my english, I hope everything is understandable.
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Hi matte225.
First of all, you're bringing a debate on "racial" aspects, which is totally irrelevant.
About the legal aspects you've "been searching for years", please read this :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Whaling_Commission
You may read this link, too :
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7188674.stm
And you can't deny the objectivity of those links. Unless you believe in a plot theory, and that the BBC is secretly a press office for greenpeace...
Even if you don't agree with the laws discussed aboved - which is your right - you're not allowed to blame anyone (especially VSTEP) for bringing "racial hate" inside what is nothing more than a Game. That is not tolerable on this forum.
And about the politics aspects you mention, I belive most game are undoubtfully much more debatable.
Sorry for my english, I hope everything is understandable.
What law is being broke? Australia has absolutely no say in anything that happens in International Waters. So your argument in invalid. Australia should mind it's own business, as they murder and skin baby roos alive for fun.
The IWC is an international organization to monitor Whale stock and to return to commercial whaling.
The bottom line is that they choose to target specifically the Japanese people, and claim that they are poachers and hunting "illegally", even when the IWC (remember, an INTERNATIONAL organization) has given them the special permits too.
You do realise there is more than one species of whale out there?
For example, Blue Whale is on the endangered list since 1986 due to commercial whaling. In fact from the same website which you provided a link of, it states that Blue Whale has been classed as 'Endangered' due to its population being plummeted by around 70% in the past 30 years. That is really bad news.
I do not wish to get into the "rights and wrongs" argument of whaling, but you do understand how people feel when there is evidence that some species of whale is under threat (while the others are not endangered, for example the Minkle whale) and why Greenpeace feel they have to intervene to prevent a total decimation of certain whale species - in this case the Blue Whale.
Who is hunting the Blue whale? No one is, especially not the Japanese people. Your argument is invalid. The game targets the Japanese people specifically. Vstep specifically said to me that they were hunting an endangered whale. So either they are mistaken, or outright lying.
What is next? A video game where you dump oil and human waste into the ocean while throwing acid at people? Sinking merchant ships maybe?
You can drive an oil tanker, can't you? GP has attacked them before...so why only target the Japanese people?
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I think the Greenpeace missions are excellent, I would like to see more of them in the future. No matter how you feel about Greenpeace, I see nothing wrong with any of the missions that are presented in this game, nobody is being "attacked" and there is no hate to be found anywhere.
John's comment "You end up giving the impression that ships are responsible for all the pollution at sea" doesn't make sense to me because this game does not suggest anything like that. The missions are about a few incidents that are illegal... would we really want a mission where you follow a ship that isn't doing anything wrong? would that be interesting?
You have to at least admit that Greenpeace does do some good. I don't think anyone here believes that dumping nuclear waste into the ocean is a good idea but I may be wrong...
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What is next? A video game where you dump oil and human waste into the ocean while throwing acid at people? Sinking merchant ships maybe?
You can drive an oil tanker, can't you? GP has attacked them before...so why only target the Japanese people?
You say they are only targeting the Japanese people? there are only 9 Greenpeace missions in the game, how could they target everyone with only 9 missions? maybe they will make up for it with some new downloadable content in the future.
And how do you go from this game to saying something like "What is next? A video game where you dump oil and human waste into the ocean while throwing acid at people"? sorry, but that makes no sense at all. None of these missions tell you to harm anyone or pollute anything.
And "Sinking merchant ships"? well... we'll just leave that to games like the Silent Hunter series...
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Your argument is invalid. The game targets the Japanese people specifically.
OK, you're not happy because Japanese people are made out to be the bad guys in the SSE game. So what about other games such as Call of Duty: Rising Sun? In that game you specifically kill Japanese soliders. Does that mean Electronic Arts (the game developer) are in the wrong as well?
I think you are turning this into a racial issue. It's only a game, for goodness sake. In fact the racial aspect of the game in SSE hadn't even entered my mind until you made a big issue of it.
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I think he is just a Troll. Please dont feed the Trolls!
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I think he is just a Troll. Please dont feed the Trolls!
Agreed, this will be my last say on this topic. 8)
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You say they are only targeting the Japanese people? there are only 9 Greenpeace missions in the game, how could they target everyone with only 9 missions? maybe they will make up for it with some new downloadable content in the future.
And how do you go from this game to saying something like "What is next? A video game where you dump oil and human waste into the ocean while throwing acid at people"? sorry, but that makes no sense at all. None of these missions tell you to harm anyone or pollute anything.
And "Sinking merchant ships"? well... we'll just leave that to games like the Silent Hunter series...
Maybe not include Greenpeace missions in the first place? What was the point of making such a political statement in a game about boats and ships? GP has been well known for its use of violence against various merchant ships. So including them seems to be supporting the violence against the shipping industry. Why claim something is illegal, and endangered when it is not? Either Vstep is lying or they are misinformed.
I have asked, and the only thing I have gotten is something that the Aussies trying to use their laws against people in International Waters.
NOTE: There is a $1000 reward (to you or org. of your choice) If you can cite what law the Japanese IWC group is violating.
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Matte225, your charge of racism and a political agenda on the part of VSTEP is ludicrous.
I’m sure it was a marketing decision. Those often defy rational analysis, based as they are on the belief that a certain interest group will be attracted to a product, while—if this is even considered—those with contrary beliefs are a small and silent minority.
While VSTEP’s intentions were apolitical, the actions of the users will probably not be. We have seen, in SS08, that many delight in using the game primarily to watch ships sink.
When the mission editor is released, we will probably see scenarios where Greenpeace has modified water cannons to squirt napalm to set whalers ablaze. The napalm must be left to the player’s imagination, but setting a conflagration aboard a ship is a trivial job in the editor.
So, you are probably wise to remain a troll. SSE might only bring you heartache.
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Matte225, your charge of racism and a political agenda on the part of VSTEP is ludicrous.
I’m sure it was a marketing decision. Those often defy rational analysis, based as they are on the belief that a certain interest group will be attracted to a product, while—if this is even considered—those with contrary beliefs are a small and silent minority.
While VSTEP’s intentions were apolitical, the actions of the users will probably not be. We have seen, in SS08, that many delight in using the game primarily to watch ships sink.
When the mission editor is released, we will probably see scenarios where Greenpeace has modified water cannons to squirt napalm to set whalers ablaze. The napalm must be left to the player’s imagination, but setting a conflagration aboard a ship is a trivial job in the editor.
So, you are probably wise to remain a troll. SSE might only bring you heartache.
Doesn't answer my question as to why Vstep seems to think that the Japanese IWC is hunting endangered whales, or that it is illegal. BTW, there is a $1000 reward for anyone who cites the law that the IWC is breaking.
What about being able to drive a Japanese research or whaling hunting vessel? Then you have to defend yourself from GP attacks. It would be quite funny to spray a bunch of ecoterrorists out of their dingy. I am sure that would sell very well. I would buy it then.
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If I am wrong about this, may someone explain what the Greenpeace mission is in the anti-Japanese mission?
I am also eagerly awaiting an answer as to why. Are there maritime people on here? How would you feel if GP sunk, rammed, or blocked your ship? It seems to me this company should be promoting safety at sea instead
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I am also eagerly awaiting an answer as to why. Are there maritime people on here?
Could be we enjoy a maritime sim :doh:
How would you feel if GP sunk, rammed, or blocked your ship?
In my career at sea I was in 2 Cod wars (Iceland) during this time we were arrested by the Thor
And on another trip fired on by the Agre recieving 3 shell holes in the bow before the navy got to us.
We were there to catch fish they were ther to stop us .
How did the crew (me) feel just wanted to earn a living pay the bills.
In my career at sea I and many others in fact all seaman share a common bond a ship in trouble for
whatever reason has no nationality.
Ships sim is a game that is to be enjoyed by all for the missions that are made by me and others as
far as it go'es greenpeace have there good points/bad points but it has nothing to do with the sim
itself they are 2/3 more good ships in a good sim.
As to V-Steps reasons for there choice only they know and I can respect that so having had my little
rant I will back to enjoying a good mission.
Eric
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In my career at sea I was in 2 Cod wars (Iceland) during this time we were arrested by the Thor
And on another trip fired on by the Agre recieving 3 shell holes in the bow before the navy got to us.
We were there to catch fish they were ther to stop us .
How did the crew (me) feel just wanted to earn a living pay the bills.
Eric
Yet VSTEP is supporting a group whos job it is to make the seas more dangerous. Since you seem to have been in danger at sea, I am sure you didnt think too kindly on the people shooting a tyou.
Well, how do the people think when GP tries to sink ships, or block them, etc? You are just there making a living, then all of a sudden you have people attacking your ship. It is my belief that any attack on a ship/car/plane/building/etc that you are in, is an attack on you. If GP rams a boat I am on, that is a threat to my life, and VSTEP seems to agree that ramming ships is an OK thing to do.
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What about being able to drive a Japanese research or whaling hunting vessel? Then you have to defend yourself from GP attacks. It would be quite funny to spray a bunch of ecoterrorists out of their dingy. I am sure that would sell very well. I would buy it then.
Verily, it maketh a difference whose ox is being gored.
Greenpeace ships are in the game because there is a perceived interest in their activity, and because they were willing to allow the use of the actual vessels and cooperate with VSTEP in developing a model of a ship still under construction. The whaling ships are in the game only as AI ships to avoid turning SSE into a combat simulator.
It is you who are attempting to politicize it and turn it into a racial matter. As you are not an Extremes user, nor a registered user of any Ship Simulator version, you are simply a troll who is using this forum as a soapbox to pursue a personal agenda with little relevance to this game.
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It`s not the first time some videogame wound certain sensitivities with political and ideological questions. In my opinion VStep should have think more carefully. There are many profesional people developing their duties on the sea. Fiscal and customs vigilance, illegal inmigration, fishing inspection, SAR missions... All of them, duties served for quiet and self-sacrificing profesionals and under international strict laws; generally they wear uniform, and of course they are not so popular and "journalistic" as Green Peace are. I`d like to see here more about those people. VStep doesn`t need this kind of mess.
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As to my personal views: I have little regard for either anti-whaling group. I think their main purpose is to garner funds and publicity through dangerous, illegal, and in the end, ineffective tactics.
While the whalers may have limited rights to take some whales, they do so for mainly commercial reasons. As a former oceanographer, I find passing off their ships as “research vessels†disingenuous at best, and somewhat offensive.
The entire rhubarb is somewhat silly; having survived the slaughters of the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, the whales are unlikely to be driven to extinction by the Japanese.
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So no one is going to answer my question of the "objective" in the anti-Japanese whaling mission? What is hte point of it in the first place? Why has VSTEP lied and said the Japanese research is illegal?
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having survived the slaughters of the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, the whales are unlikely to be driven to extinction by the Japanese.
An interesting point.Why is Japan the only country allowed to yearly kill hundreds of whales for "Scientific Research" ?
Why not other countries, like Iceland, Norway, China, Russia, Netherlands, Greenland, U.S., etc..?
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So no one is going to answer my question of the "objective" in the anti-Japanese whaling mission? What is hte point of it in the first place? Why has VSTEP lied and said the Japanese research is illegal?
No one has answered your question because it is not a question, but a diatribe disguised as a question.
The purpose of the Greenpeace missions is entertainment.
By calling VSTEP liars, you have abused the hospitality they have extended you on this forum.
The forum is for users of the Ship Simulator series and those who are interested in becoming users. You are clearly neither.
I’m locking this topic. Find a soapbox elsewhere.