Ship Simulator
English forum => Small talk => Topic started by: jemagnussen on July 25, 2008, 18:52:23
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Hi m8's,
Is it just me, or are we many getting a bit bored with SS 2008...? I don't care much about the missions, many of them are just too long and not really challenging, but that's just me, I have several years experience running smaller tug boats in connection with my work, and have for the past 20 years had private vessels. I'm into MP, the working together with other likeminded is the great part...
Only getting new vessels won't make it for me, I will need some more inter-activity to get my interest back in the simulator. In my opinion it should be developed more in the direction simulator and less in the direction arcade. Proper bridge controls, active nav system, active radar system, active AIS and IMO numbers, ability to name the vessels and change the colors, even be able to fly your countrys colors. More inter-activity would f.ex. be cargo handling, having the push-boat bring barges with containers and bulk cargo to deep water quays to be loaded on container vessels and others with working cranes. Getting sim-dollars (or probably € considering the fall of the old greenback) for moving freight, to be used for buying newer and larger vessels, pay for tug assistance, repairs etc. etc.
Let me know if I'm alone and should start to look for something else to do, or if we are enough to put pressure on Vstep. Maybe the idea of a SDK is not the immediate cup of tea for Vstep, but could be the only way forward...!
"MS Magnus"
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Ok, i'll be honest with you on this one, you have spoken my mind, this has been my point all along, our simulator needs to be more realistic as regards to bridge equipment etc. and i think SS needs to be more interactive, when i say interactive i mean, to be able to open and close doors manually, to be able to turn lights on and off at your own will, to be able to launch lifeboats and use them, to be able to open bow doors for ships to drive on and off, perosnal vessels is also something i long for.
I just sometimes wonder whether we are getting anywhere with SS? I don't mean to offend v-step but i honestly think our simulation could be a lot better if v-step wanted to do it, and, Goax's model of the Berge Stahl, that is fabulous, yet v-step haven't even bothered to reply to Goax, aperently? almost everyone wants the Berge Stahl in the game and it could earn v-step a hell of a lot of cash, but they don't seem to be bothered.
And whats with this "ShipDriver" thing?
http://www.shipsim.com/ShipSimForum/index.php/topic,8922.0.html
I'll give my honest opinion on this, i think it is expensive, cheap and tacky, and i certainly wouldn't buy it. And 64 people have said they wouldn't buy it for that price, yet v-step have been given the Berge Stahl as an option to earn money on, yet they go out and talk about this ship driver thing that looks tacky!
I honestly believe v-step need to re-think some of their decisions, and i think v-step need to start offering top simulation. I can understand that this simulation is pretty new, but i think v-step are certainly capable of making our simulation better, but they don't seem to be doing it.
Jack :-\
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Hi! I also would like to buy and sell ships and use tu help for money
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Ok, i'll be honest with you on this one, you have spoken my mind, this has been my point all along, our simulator needs to be more realistic as regards to bridge equipment etc. and i think SS needs to be more interactive, when i say interactive i mean, to be able to open and close doors manually, to be able to turn lights on and off at your own will, to be able to launch lifeboats and use them, to be able to open bow doors for ships to drive on and off, perosnal vessels is also something i long for.
I just sometimes wonder whether we are getting anywhere with SS? I don't mean to offend v-step but i honestly think our simulation could be a lot better if v-step wanted to do it, and, Goax's model of the Berge Stahl, that is fabulous, yet v-step haven't even bothered to reply to Goax, aperently? almost everyone wants the Berge Stahl in the game and it could earn v-step a hell of a lot of cash, but they don't seem to be bothered.
And whats with this "ShipDriver" thing?
http://www.shipsim.com/ShipSimForum/index.php/topic,8922.0.html
I'll give my honest opinion on this, i think it is expensive, cheap and tacky, and i certainly wouldn't buy it. And 64 people have said they wouldn't buy it for that price, yet v-step have been given the Berge Stahl as an option to earn money on, yet they go out and talk about this ship driver thing that looks tacky!
I honestly believe v-step need to re-think some of their decisions, and i think v-step need to start offering top simulation. I can understand that this simulation is pretty new, but i think v-step are certainly capable of making our simulation better, but they don't seem to be doing it.
Jack :-\
I also agree :-\. I find that I am playing SS less and less every week :-\. I think the experience whould be better if I had a better graphics card though ;D.
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Hi
I do enjoy ss very much but do agree. I know you shouldnt compare fs to ss, but the fact that other people seem to making their own ships makes me think that like fs we should be able to use other peoples creations on ss.
Like with the navy ships topic already raised. on fsx you can fly millitary planes but cant use their weapons but you dont need to. its great just flying a tornado or spitfire. it would be the same for a type45 or hms ark royal!!! sailing her into portsmouth would be wonderfull.
More ports, more ships and more action on the boats. not alot to ask really :)
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I also agree :-\. I find that I am playing SS less and less every week :-\. I think the experience whould be better if I had a better graphics card though ;D.
Hi Captain,
Don't hold your hopes too high for a better graphics card, I have an Nvidia 9800GTX on a hefty pc with lot's of ram and a fast disk, look's ok and have frame rates of 60, but does not do anything to the longer term interest in the sim. Jack has a lot of good points - let's face it, the vessels handling charateristics are done very well and quite realistic, water surface looks good, but we have to get further. Vstep might be on the way - I don't know, but for me it takes too long. This could change with taking advantage of a good SDK (And I keep hopes high for a soon death to Questviewer). I know that Vstep would loose out on some possibilities to cash in on the add-ons, but if they don't develop faster I'm afraid they will loose much more.
"MS Magnus"
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whats sdk?
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whats sdk?
Hi m8,
SDK = Software Development Kit... you can see a comprehensive explanation on Wikipedia... in short: It would make it possible for a lot of independent software developers to develop add-ons to Shipsim..
"MS Magnus"
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that would be awsome
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I also agree :-\. I find that I am playing SS less and less every week :-\. I think the experience whould be better if I had a better graphics card though ;D.
same i used to play it all the time but i am now hardly ever on it
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This is the whole reason I started modeling my own ships for the game I figured it would give me something to do. ;)
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This is the whole reason I started modeling my own ships for the game I figured it would give me something to do. ;)
Hi m8,
That proves the saying "Nothing is so bad that it's not good for something" - you do a hell of a good job at modeling, keep it up. We should probably thank Vstep for being a bit slow... :D, seriously m8, I admire your work and wish I could do something like that.
"MS Magnus"
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Have you seen my latest Dredger?
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Have you seen my latest Dredger?
Yes m8, and I love it, hope some day to see the dredgepump running and the rainbow feeding land reclamation for a new container area. I will be around to do the sheetpiles... :D
"MS Magnus"
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I certainly agree that more interactivity within the sim would be better. Much more is needed in the way cargo is handled. It gets very boring just moving from point "a" to point "b" ,etc.
An SDK is absolutly a geat idea! This has been discussed much in the past in the SS06 days.
"MS Magnus", all of your ideas are right on the money. And that could translate into real money for VStep, because it will keep their current cutomers happy, as well as bringing more simmers on board. We pay good money for the product and we want to get much more use from it and not get bored and stop playing.
WW
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In my opinion VSTEP need to get there act together and listen to the members of this forum a lot more. Several great quality ships have been made by users, and have been completely ignored. Requests to fix bugs/ships have been made and ignored. A topic was made asking us for our ideal servers, that looked good, but it seems like it has now been forgotten about. As Jack points out, a brilliant Berge Stahl has been made by Goax, with only 2 people voting "no" to the question "would you like this ship in the game?". Yet, VSTEP ignore this poll, and decide to go with a tacky looking piece of junk from the 1940s (Some may call it a ShipDriver) while 60+ people say they wouldn't buy it. PMs to the admins and development team are ignored too.
If VSTEP want to make a great game where users are satisfied with the content, they should stop counting there millions and come listen to us.
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Yep in a way i agree, this game has cost enough by makin it and research and i know they prob needed the money from the game to go on.
But there are to much bugs still in it, if you write them (vstep) a mail you prob get a mail back by xmas 2011, they just dont respond to anything.
The game was'nt ready when it came out, and after all the fixes and downloads its still not finished.
I like the game, but there is no challenge anymore, i hope they listen to the board members for a change.
Best regards, frank
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Yes, I do think that V-STEP should mlisten to us, its costomers. I have never seen an admin say in a post" Wow, that looks like a great Idea! I will put that on a list to the development team. Who knows, maybe we could include this ship in SS09!" Nope, they, never in a thousand years, whould do that >:(. They don't seem to be interested in our opinions. I think they just pick what they wan't to model, not even caring if the public likes it!" Who cares! As long as the members buy the game, we are set!" I do concur that a lot of people are upset to see that a lot of common ships are neglected, such as the QM2. Or, even a simple taker! They could also give us some feedback about our suggestions :-\. Don't see that happening ::).
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From the tone of these posts, I think it would be foolish for VSTEP to sink a lot of resources into catering to the wants of customers who become so quickly bored. No matter how far they develop the product, those people will be quickly bored and demand still more.
A slow progress to their own vision for their product, as they are doing, makes more sense in the long run. There will always be new customers, along with the majority of less vocal current customers who are too busy enjoying what the sim has to offer.
Very few of the sensible additions posted, often repeated ad nauseam by every newcomer, have not occurred before to the developers. They are discussed and evaluated on the basis of desirability and feasibility within the present architecture. Many will eventually find their way into the sim when it is developed to the point where it is possible to do so.
Some can only be done after a major change in some part of the architecture—as will happen with SS2009. Some will probably never be implemented—people scurrying about the ships—because they are a useless departure from the core purpose of the product, and would have an adverse impact on performance.
Throwing the product open to third party providers of ships or environments makes absolutely no business sense, and they would lose those customers who appreciate the quality maintained by VSTEP.
SS is open to modelers who can produce ships to the requirements of VSTEP. Those requirements have been explained in posts by DJM and myself. They include more than just the appearance of the model, but other things necessary to the functioning of the vessel in the simulator. There are very few 3D modelers who can work to those standards.
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It is not so much that we are getting bored with the simulator itself, but in my opinion, the ships and enviornment selection is getting quite old. I think that the shipyard is going to offer the simmers a better experience with new ships and enviornments. I think that we are just getting hungry for new challenges, new ships and enviornments. Especially the multiplayer crane operations, that is becoming a very wantable feature. What I do not understand, is that you think that V-STEP should not care as much about our opinions as to their own. Of course they should follow their drams and create what they want in the sim, but they do need to follow the wishes of others. They cannot simply feel that all of their dreams will meet the expectations of others. That is why we all have our own thoughts.
It is not that I am bored,(Because I don't ever get bored with anything, not even waiting ;D. I am the master of boredum ;D) but rather seeking for more ships and new enviornments. I also do really think that I would enjoy the sim more if I did have better equiptment, Mangus. What fun is it to have your ship accelerate to top speeds in about 10 mintues, when a person with better equiptment can reach top speeds in about 2 minutes. What fun is it to not see foam or smoke? NONE!
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It is their product. They certainly do have the right to ignore requests or suggestions that take the sim in a direction that they never intended, and that in their judgment would be to the detriment of their product.
They, alone, are in a position to judge whether a particular change or addition is feasible at the present time, and is worth diverting resources from the many other necessary tasks.
Many of the things that are demanded are ill conceived and would cause problems that the demanders have neither the knowledge nor imagination to understand.
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We aren't getting bored with the simulation mvsmith, well i'm not anyway, i'm probably one of the most active users on MP, so i don't want to sound like i'm complaining, But i just feel that v-step aren't listening to us, and i don't like that.
And i think you are right with your points above, BUT i think v-step need to start paying more attention to us, we are the ones playing their game, and if we point something out, its only going to earn them more money, and make everyone else happy. Obviously they would have to draw the line somewhere regarding how much they could do over a period of time.
But the likes of Goax, he has worked on the model of the Berge Stahl for SS, yet v-step haven't even bothered to at least give him feedback, aperently? i feel this is a clear indication that v-step need to listen to our opinions more, just to make their game better, then, everyone is happy. But like i said above, they would have to draw the line somewhere.
That is my personal opinion,
Jack.
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Hi Chaps.
I don't know the ins and outs of the Berge Stahl, nor of Vstep's responses so I won't comment on that. But, if I can give you a technical perspective: images of a ship, no matter how wonderful they may look, are merely the starting point for a new vessel. The real work is in developing all of the programming aspects to make it look and react something like a real ship in Ship Simulator.
Just my own estimate based upon my own modelling in Train Simulators, but for every hour spent on the images, there may be somthing like 50 - 100 hours of programming time, plus something similar in verification and validation testing.
You'll understand that is an enormous amount of work.
As an example, can you image what it takes to hook up the ship controls and make them work for every position and every viewpoint? And that's small stuff, comparatively.
If only programming was as simple as every non-programmer believes it to be.... ;)
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You are absolutely correct Terry, the task ahead is of huge proportions & would tax the top companies like MS.
However, a start has to be made, otherwise VSTEP will lose out as people fade away.
A proper development plan needs to be put in place, with this visible to SS users, so they can see what's going to happen.
I know this will cause loads of arguments & discussions, but it has to be the way forward. I do not want to see VSTEP lose out, as they have done an incredible job so far.
This will take alot of time effort & resource, & will never stop, but as you can see from the number of SS members, people will buy it. SS is amazing & has the potential to be so much more.
Captain Jack
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You are absolutely correct Terry, the task ahead is of huge proportions & would tax the top companies like MS.
However, a start has to be made, otherwise VSTEP will lose out as people fade away.
A proper development plan needs to be put in place, with this visible to SS users, so they can see what's going to happen.
I know this will cause loads of arguments & discussions, but it has to be the way forward. I do not want to see VSTEP lose out, as they have done an incredible job so far.
This will take alot of time effort & resource, & will never stop, but as you can see from the number of SS members, people will buy it. SS is amazing & has the potential to be so much more.
Captain Jack
Yes, that is correct John, v-step have done a great job but just don't seem to be moving forward at this current time. That is the issues i have with v-step.
Jack.
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Just one question I have then... how do you know it's not moving forward?
You cannot look into VSTEP's kitchen, so to speak, can you?
We as staffmembers are lucky enough to be able to see more of what goes on behind the scenes, and some of the remarks posted here would not have been made if all of us here had that same ability.
They just opened the shipyard, there is one new ship, and another one coming. NH isn't that old yet either. And as Terry so rightly pointed out, it takes a long long time to get a ship functioning properly, the model itself is just the tip of the iceberg. You cannot expect them to put out addon after addon after addon. These things take lots of time.
There are (off the top of my head) 25 or 26 ships we can sail and do all kinds of jobs with. Together with the ME, the sky is the limit. :)
If you are bored with all those vessels, then a new one will probably bore you quite fast aswell.
VSTEP is well aware of the wishes of the customers, and most of the things that were added or changed, were suggested by the community. They are indeed moving forward all the time, as not doing so would be very bad for business. But the community often seems to forget how much time and effort is involved and I'm sorry to say, expects a bit too much, sometimes.
That's just how I see it...
Regards,
Fred
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Just one question I have then... how do you know it's not moving forward?
You cannot look into VSTEP's kitchen, so to speak, can you?
We as staffmembers are lucky enough to be able to see more of what goes on behind the scenes, and some of the remarks posted here would not have been made if all of us here had that same ability.
They just opened the shipyard, there is one new ship, and another one coming. NH isn't that old yet either. And as Terry so rightly pointed out, it takes a long long time to get a ship functioning properly, the model itself is just the tip of the iceberg. You cannot expect them to put out addon after addon after addon. These things take lots of time.
There are (off the top of my head) 25 or 26 ships we can sail and do all kinds of jobs with. Together with the ME, the sky is the limit. :)
If you are bored with all those vessels, then a new one will probably bore you quite fast aswell.
VSTEP is well aware of the wishes of the customers, and most of the things that were added or changed, were suggested by the community. They are indeed moving forward all the time, as not doing so would be very bad for business. But the community often seems to forget how much time and effort is involved and I'm sorry to say, expects a bit too much, sometimes.
That's just how I see it...
Regards,
Fred
But, v-step haven't even bothered to take any notice of Goax's model, they should at least give him feedback, even if v-step don't want it in the game. I don't expect a lot from v-step, but i do expect that when we suggest something, that we get feedback from v-step.
Also, Flight Simulator constantly make improvements and develop new things. And with every new game, a huge leap forward is made, but, with v-step, we aren't getting anything "new" as such, we are getting some new ships, i'll admitt that, and i am pleased with them. But, there haven't been hardly any changes as regards to more interactivity, whereas Flight Simulator is constantly adding new things to make it more realistic, we got the patch for the engine switches, fuel gages etc. but that is just the basics of a ship.
Even Virtual Sailor includes GPS's on the bridge, lights you can turn on and off etc. but i will admit, i think Virtual Sailor is no way near the standard of Ship Simulator, Ship Simulator being better. But what i mean is, if Virtual Sailor can have these interactive buttons and features on the bridge and outside, and its not a very good simulator, Why dosen't ship simulator have this? v-step is of far better quality so i would assume v-step could develop these things no problem?
And when we do suggest things, it is only for Ship Simulator's good, yet we don't seem to get any responce? again, I don't expect a lot, but i would think that at least, there should be some little developments to make our simulation a bit better? or we should recieve feedback on the idea, and plans for the future, i think John Carter has got the right idea.
I don't mean this to sound cheeky or rude, it is just my personal opinion, and what could make SS a little better :) and as a plus, v-step have done a great job with SS as a pretty new simulator, but these are just our suggestions to make it better. ;) :)
Jack.
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Just one question I have then... how do you know it's not moving forward?
You cannot look into VSTEP's kitchen, so to speak, can you?
They've had enough time to develop new features - so where are they?
I don't want to sound rude, i'm glad we have a ship simulator that doesn't look like some 1980s Nintendo game (*Virtual Sailor*) but VSTEO aren't doing much in the way of listening to our opinion, they just give us something incomplete (Pride of Rotterdam, Titanic, several features etc.) and hope we'll like it. And when we say it needs impoving, they wander off and make something else.
The Berge Stahl looked finished back in August 2007, and does it really take 1 year to convert all the necessary stuff and script the dynamics? If they had listened to us, instead of making a patch that was so bad it was taken off the site and working on a cruddy looking controller (that isn't even compatible for the newer game, but the 2006 version), we may of been sailing Goaxs wonderful work in the sim.
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Fred,
I think that General Motors is responsible for the problem: The rapidity with which they respond to customer requests for patches to fix problems, and updates to add new features to their cars, has produced unrealistic expectations. Their practice of responding to every suggestion with a personal letter of thanks from the CEO, along with a timetable for delivery on the request, has set a standard that VSTEP may find it difficult to meet.
Marty
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They've had enough time to develop new features - so where are they?
Yes, i have to agree with you there. Thats what everyone else seems to be saying as well, on the forum and on MP. This is what we are trying to get accross to v-step, we don't expect a lot, but like Nathan says, they have had a long time to develop new features, and if there are new features coming, why are we not told about them? and where are they?
Jack.
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Jack has raised another point - why are we all sat around this forum kicking dust not knowing about these new features that are apparently being tested. VSTEP could at least tell us about upcoming features to keep us interested.
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They've had enough time to develop new features - so where are they?
What an arrogant statement!
How can you know that they have had enough time? In fact the very idea that VSTEP must listen to you, and cater to your whims, reeks of arrogance, not to mention childishness and ignorance of what is involved.
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Oh not again......Is it possible to say something on this forum without someone stepping out and attacking one of your posts >:(
I'm on breaking point with this forum, some members are rude, ignorant, VSTEP listen to no one. The sim was launched 1 year ago, they've had plenty of time to develop new features! If they just look at the Features Request board they could make some of the excellent ideas in the game and actually have more satisfied players, plus a better sim! All of these would make a better Simulation, that's what it is meant to be.
I don't know wether to stop posting here and keep my liscence keys so i can play Multiplayer or delete my account and go somewhere more pleasent......anywhere is more polite than here ::)
I've met some pretty damn rude members on this forum............
Edit: Hang on a sec.....what's all this equipment in Virtual Sailor?
(http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/381/vsom5.png) (http://imageshack.us)
Well, this ship was made by a normal guy. VSTEP has a large development team and yet, they can't even put this equipment into the sim!? Useable or not, it can't be hard to just put it on the Bridge of a ship? Now that says something to me, a normal 3rd Party modeler can put all this detailed equipment into his ship but VSTEP cannot...
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What an arrogant statement!
How can you know that they have had enough time? In fact the very idea that VSTEP must listen to you, and cater to your whims, reeks of arrogance, not to mention childishness and ignorance of what is involved.
I find what you have said more ignorant, to be honest. You have no right to challange Nathan's opinion, when i say something i mean it as in my opinion, and what could make SS better, but i do not agree with direct attacks on members for their own personal opinions.
I will not be at this topic any more, otherwise i will blow my top
Jack.
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Let's not get unfriendly here, gentlemen. No need for that, we're all amongst friends here! ;)
You can say that VSTEP has had enough time, but how do you know that for a fact?
You don't, that's really all there is to it.
I can take a look behind the scenes, I know what goes on with the testing stage of new features or addons. It's not as easy to "just make new stuff" as some of you like to think, I must say.
I can name plenty of games and sims that do not have as much development going on as SS08 has. It's all in the eye of the beholder, so to speak. I have lots of titles on my shelf that have had maybe one patch along the way, and no addons at all. Nor any further development.
You just got NH, that's not out too long, you have had a number of patches in (compared to other titles) quite rapid succession. Several big changes have been made to the sim, several bits of new content has been added, the shipyard has been opened, and with all this, they have been EXTREMELY busy, to take the sim to new levels.
How quick do you think they can come up with the next new stuff? Furie is just out, Elbe is due to follow, any idea how much work and testing goes into just those two ships? A LOT!
They are not sitting around slacking off, I can tell you. VSTEP also has to focus on SS09/10 now, so you can imagine that this takes extra time and effort too, which cannot be spent on SS08 at the same time.
You just cannot suggest that VSTEP is slacking off unless you have first hand knowledge of this, and to do so, is indeed arrogant. But you should not take a word like that as a personal attack, it's just the truth.
VSTEP is constantly doing what the community asks, as I said before, so you cannot claim that they do not listen. Just because someone has (what appears to be) a great idea, does not mean that it is ready to go for development. There's much more involved than just taking an idea and making it real. All changes that have been made, are made because the customer asked for it or complained about it.
The Berge Stahl was mentioned, well who ever said that it was being converted to SS08 right now? It was suggested, it is made, yes, but Goax also made the pushboat that we all got in NH. So his work IS in the game allready and not being ignored at all. Maybe Berge Stahl just isn't feasable at this point, because none of the harbors is really deep enough to take her. That would mean you can only use it in free roam in open seas. That's not worth all the development costs really. Right? Right!
I'm not saying that this is the case, because I don't know what the plans - if any - are for that vessel, but it seems logical and I just want to show you that there's more to think about. You might view the sim from an MP perspective, maybe you like to just sail around with your friends on MP. That's getting boring much faster than playing loads of custom mission that you could create yourself. Personally, that's much more my thing and as such I have years and years of material to work with... But to each his own of course.
Again, just because there are brilliant ideas in the suggestions board, does not mean that it's all possible right away, there can be serious changes needed in the game to make them happen that you and me might not know anything about. So how can we claim to know what's what then?
I agree with you that there are many good ideas that should really be in the game, but VSTEP also knows about those, they read the forum and we as staff also give them a lot of feedback in your name, trust me.
They do listen, and they do want to include the ideas of the community and the models that the talented guys like Goax make. But you can't have it all at the same time, it takes time. And they have to run a business, so if it is not cost effective, why should they do it? That would be unwise.
Sorry for this long post, heh heh.. but I just want to put things into perspective. Rest assured that VSTEP will always be aiming to make the sim better and to grant the wishes of the community, because they are their customers and without them there would be no product. But you have to realise how much work is involved and you cannot just go and say that they don't listen and don't deliver. Because that's just not fair to say without anything to back up your statement.
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dont foget vstep only have 30 members of staff
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They are not sitting around slacking off, I can tell you. VSTEP also has to focus on SS09/10 now, so you can imagine that this takes extra time and effort too, which cannot be spent on SS08 at the same time.
In my opinion VSTEP should focus on expanding SS2008, not start developing a new game.
*Waits for Rude member to come along and call him Arrogant
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Well, please calm down Nathan !
you wrote lots of things, but please stay calm. First of all, your post is aggressive, it's quite normal people reply the same way (which is not my feeling about mvsmith reply, but that's another point).
Don't forget Ship Simulator is a game. It's not the only product from Vstep, all other products are for professional market, and those are certainly more important that Ship Sim, which is only for entertainment. If you have doubts about this, please have a look at VSTEP web site ( http://www.vstep.nl ). when you talk about "large development team", do you really believe there are 50 developpers, payed by Vstep, just to develop ship sim and addons ?? please be realistic !!
You said vstep was losing time developing a hardware platform. This one is developped by RailDriver, which has absolutely nothing in common with Vstep - http://www.raildriver.com/ .
Ship Sim still needs improvements, we all agree about that.
Things don't go fast enough for you, or don't go the way you think they should, but please pay attention to what you write . You're talking about men, who do their work the best they can, with lots of contraints you don't even imagine.
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Hi Chaps.
To add to Fred and Denis's comments: This topic has turned from a reasonable, well reasoned discussion into a bit of screaming match. No need!
Please gentlemen, take a deep breath before you post inflamatory comments or start shouting at other people. It's summer (in the northern hemisphere). The weather is nice and life is too short to have arguments about trivial matters. ;D
I promise you, Vstep do listen to your comments. The fact that they don't always respond is not rudeness on their part, though. How many times have you asked Microsoft to do something? Ever get a reply? How about from Nintendo? or Bethseda? If Vstep answered all of the requests, they would have to loose a member of the programming team, most likely.
I suggest that you take the time to look through all of the threads on this forum about "Why dont' Vstep...." or "New Vessels" etc. You'll see that virtually every port in the world is wanted, with few people wanting the same ones. You'll see that almost every type of vessel is demanded, often with a statement about how simple it must be to do this, by the poster.
You'll see that every conceivable weather pattern is wanted, including waterspouts and monsoons and blizzards, not to mention those damned giant waves ( :P). You'll aslo see that every vessel type that someone wants, is matched by someone else who doesn't want it. "I want more big ships, I want more small ships, I hate big ships, I love big ships".
No matter what they do, someone will be disappointed. But at least you can tell them.
At the end of the day, Vstep have to pay their bills. For an addition to be worthwhile, it would have to sell some thousands or tens or hundreds of thousands of copies, just to recoup the development costs.
If a ship takes a man-year of time in total (I suspect in total it takes a lot more, but use this as an example), then someone's wages for the year must be covered. Plus the time of the HR dept and Finance Dept and Admin and the electricity and the Government taxes and... and... and... Work it out. The costs of development are immense. I know.
So, some on. A bit more tolerance, please. Chill out, eh? ;D
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Gentlemen, after allowing the steam to die down a little, this thread is now re-opened.
But, if it degenerates into attacks and anger again, it will be locked permanently.
Thank you.
Happy sailing. Chill out!
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I am a little staemed, and I think Nathan is too :(.
Anyway, I do think that the shipyard will increase our gaming experience by offering us more ships to operate ;). I just really want new ships ;D!
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i think vstep should put the basics right first, before adding more stuff.
e.g
ability to moor in MP, currently we can only use anchors.
little boats sinking big ones just by touching them, how daft is that.
ability to use steering when in text speak (i have a wheel & it don't work)
please get the simple things done & then move on to more realistic stuff.
thanks for listening ..... captain jack
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I gues sthat the problem with enabling the controls while you type would mean that when you type "Hi". You will sound the horn and get the information pane. If you see what I mean.. ;D
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There is already a topic about mooring in MP already I beleive. No? Is it just my imagination from a similar post ;D?
I think adding the ability to moor in multiplayer whould be helpful, but not manditory. Not exactly the "Basics" of the game. But I whould like to see that.
I really do think that ramming a bigger vessel with a smaller one just by a touch needs to be fixed. But, that is why there is the option to have no damage ;).
I don't really find the steering in teamspeak any diffrent than using the mouse to steer with the wheel.
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There some places to moor in some environments, I believe.
Nathan has kindly posted pictures and descriptions previously. I guess the search function should bring them up if you're interetsed.
In a few cases, you can moor against some of the vessels built into the environment (that's know as "rafting").
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terry
i take your point on that one.
do you think any of the other stuff i mentioned might get fixed either in ss08 or ss10 ?
cheers ......... captain jack
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nathan
where can i moor in mp m8
captain jack
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Well, there is plenty of time for patches. There is always the possibility that what you mentioned might be in a patch. Just not a big possibility :(.
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i forgot to mention, i like big guns too.
someone said virtual sailor has these, is that true ?
captain jack
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I don't know if virtual sailor has them but SS is not going to build a battleship ;D.
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Hiya Captain Jack,
Yes, some vessels in VS can use weapons (if they have them), but it's not very good IMHO. It looks very poor to be honest and it sounds rubbish aswell, as it's not really developed properly as such. The projectile gets fired, and a target can be hit, but that's about as far as it goes.. Some subs can fire torpedo's too. But as I said, the whole weapons system part of VS, compared to real naval combat sims/games, is rubbish.
Regards,
Fred
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fred
thanks for that, saved me a few pounds.
can you suggest a good battleship sim
captain jack
don't worry, i loooooove ss08
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Well to be honest, I don't really play naval combat sims that focus on surface vessels.
I mainly play the Silent Hunter series, when it comes to naval combat.
I think "Dangerous Waters" is a good title, but I don't know that one personally.
Perhaps someone else here that does know more about it or other games like it can add something aswell?
Fred
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thanks for that fred, i'll look it up.
cheers
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My pleasure! :)
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ps
i wish i had a face like yours fred, it's really cute.
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Hehe... well if you are refering to my avatar then thanks..
But my real life ugly mug is hardly what you'd call cute.. ;D
Fred
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lets see it ...........
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Nah.. I'm too shy.. hahah..
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Hi John.
I've played Silent Hunter since V1. V2 is my favourite though. Been playing one game for many years (in real time). Great fun.
PS you can see my real face on Youtube. (2 hours on the Solent and another set I'm posting right now). But keep young children away from the screen or they'll need treatment afterwards.
Fun In Chichester Harbour & the Solent Part 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOY-dFyR9wQ
Leaving Chichester Marina, fuelling up and down through Itechenor
Spot the missus!
We followed the Harbourmaster's RIB for a while. Ollie (one of the Harbourmasters Staff) and my son play in the same football team.
Fun In Chichester Harbour & the Solent Part 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DB69fggRA-Y
Rounding East Head and out into the choppy waters of the Solent
Part 3 being uploaded at the moment
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ps
i wish i had a face like yours fred, it's really cute.
Hey Fred, who is your character supposed to be anyway? Someone from sesame street ;D? Or how about the muppets ;D?
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Hi guys, as requested:
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EDIT: I have found the horn, it's on a boat called the Bass Boat which came with the game, but the horn isn't in the files.....
2ND EDIT: GOTCHA!!
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Thanks Nathan.
PS links to two of Thursdays Solent videos are above, now.
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Sorry Terry, wrong horn, i'm desperately trying to find it - won't take long
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thanks nathan for the mooring locations. i'll try them out.
captain jack
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fred
thanks for that, saved me a few pounds.
can you suggest a good battleship sim
captain jack
don't worry, i loooooove ss08
Even though they are not battleships there is a game called Pt boats knights of the sea comeing out eventualy. Looks kind of intresting. also eventhough you have to regester to read the fourms at subsim. There are some veary good battleships that are controalable and most have a controalable gun and two AAs. But they are for silent hunter 4. which is a good game even without them. ;)
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Hey Fred, who is your character supposed to be anyway? Someone from sesame street ;D? Or how about the muppets ;D?
It's Animal, the drummer of "Dr. Teeth and the Electric Mayhem", the band on the Muppet Show. ;D
Being a drummer myself, he has always been a hero of mine. So he makes a good avatar for me. ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yvHWyvexZA&feature=related
Fred.
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It's Animal, the drummer of "Dr. Teeth and the Electric Mayhem", the band on the Muppet Show. ;D
Being a drummer myself, he has always been a hero of mine. So he makes a good avatar for me. ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yvHWyvexZA&feature=related
Fred.
Here are more you Fred LOL
(http://i36.tinypic.com/302ca6v.gif)
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;D
Thanks Tore!
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Hiya all :)
I'd like to comment on some of the posts made here..........you all know me by now ;)
I personally feel that the backup from VSTEP is admirable, and they should be commended for it. Why do I say this?
Because I'm a Moderator? No.
Because I'm getting paid by VSTEP? No.
Because I have something to gain from saying this? No.
I'm referring to a personal experience of mine from late 2006, and early 2007. I bought a game from my usual haunt (play.com). The franchise had worked quite well in previous games, and I already had games made by this particular company. I won't be naming the company, or the game, but I WILL NOT be buying ANYTHING from them again......EVER!!!
The game was released with more hype than your 'above average' Hollywood blockbuster. None of that hype was delivered. The game was unplayable from the outset, they released 2 patches, 3+ months later, and they destroyed the game even more. Multiplayer was completely dead, only 3 months after release.
Despite many requests on their forum, and a complaints thread that went into hundreds of posts (I also posted), the developers walked away, and left the game broken >:( >:(
This was not a small developer, and the publisher is also one of the largest around too. Never dismiss a company, when they are still actively involved in development of their product. Things can get much worse, so try to keep an open mind ;)
Regards.
Carl.
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;D
Thanks Tore!
MY pleasure my friend
Tore
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Some people have short memories not long ago a problem reported on the
forum a member of v-step staff left home to go to the office and check it
out for them.
No other company in the world would do that SO if thats not caring about
there customers tell me what is.
Eric
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HI all,
why all this complaining on V-Step they do a fantastic job and what kind of game will it be if the staff shod following all post on the forum instead to make more fun for us and make new things, no V-Step are listing and do a god job, the Adm and moderators are their to be a link to v-step and a big help for us, lat us honor their all job's instead to complain, we peoples are wherry god to complain, but say god thing are difficult seems it to be
Sadsid cu dent sad it bather and Carl to
Some people have short memories not long ago a problem reported on the
forum a member of v-step staff left home to go to the office and check it
out for them.
No other company in the world would do that SO if thats not caring about
there customers tell me what is.
Eric
constructive critic wit a reason for it are OK, but all this nagging and complaining aren't necessary
that's my thinking of it, and in the end, i made a topics for the release of NH and gave them positive speak their, NOW ONE answered it at all
Hurray for the v -step and all theirs members and all mods and admin on the forum
And the game is just get beater and beater
TJK
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Can we please forget about this? We've only just sorted it all out and now it's been brought up again :(
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It strikes me that the ones who complain the loudest and make the most objectionable comments are the very ones who contribute the least.
(Terry is in Irritated Mode) ???
There is an immense amount of additional input that goes on from Vstep. For instance, most games do not provide servers hosted by the Developer. You have to do it all yourslf. Vstep could have taken that route.
Most games do not provide free extras. While bug fixes might be free (and that is certainly not always the ase), very few provide substantial extras, like Vstep have done.
And as you say, one of the Developers drove in on his weekend especially to write a fix for a problem. Ever heard of Microsoft or Nintendo doing that? Of course not.
Well said, Eric.
(sorry Nathan)
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Can we please forget about this? We've only just sorted it all out and now it's been brought up again :(
You did not start this topic, and it is not up to you to say what can be discussed here.
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You did not start this topic, and it is not up to you to say what can be discussed here.
I am beginning to loose my temper with your comments and attitude now >:(
There was no need to come back with your rude attitude and start yet another argument - probably giving me the blame again, like last time.
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Relax gentlemen.
Nathan, you think Marty should not have come back with a comment about it, but you did the same thing.
If you say that you wish us to respect your opinions, you must also respect those of others, like the opinion Carl expressed, or Tore. Asking to 'forget about it' is then like saying, 'please do not express you opinion'.
So you cannot have it both ways, if you want to state yours, you have to let others state theirs too. If people have something to add to the discussion in a polite way, they may. Marty was not rude, he merely stated a fact. But the direct way in which he does so might seem rude to you. It doesn't seem rude to me though. You cannot tell anyone what they can or cannot say, if they don't break the rules.
And no rule was broken. The discussion itself was a valid one, it was the heated part of the discussion and unsubstantiated claims, that we have to forget about. But we all have opinions and we can always agree to disagree, but we can all express them freely.
So let's all take a breath a realise that there's no problem here, mate.
Regards,
Fred
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Relax gentlemen.
Nathan, you think Marty should not have come back with a comment about it, but you did the same thing.
I am not just going to stand there and let someone be rude to me ;)
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Hi Nathan.
It's all in the viewpoint. Personally, I enjoy Marty's "straight to the point" comments. I never saw that as rude, merely direct.
There is a lot of pussy-footing that goes on here while people try so hard to find ways to nearly say what they mean. I'm probably a bit more blunt than some.
But Marty didn't call you names or insult your intelligence. He didn't start a separate thread claiming that you weren't worth having (oh, no. That's reserved for people who want to attack the Moderators!). He directly stated a perfectly good fact.
Like you, Marty contributes a great deal to this community. There is no need for disagreement between you. So, please don't see insult where it isn't intended. I think I know Marty well enough to say this. ;D
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Hi everyone,
I already said my point before, i'm not getting involved again. I'm just saying this so you don't think i tried to make trouble then leave for the fun of it. (I don't mean that in an ignorant way :))
I just don't want fighting again. At the moment things aren't too good, i have a funeral to attend tomorrow. And i feel i have already made my point that v-step HAVE done and excellent job, BUT they have much to improve, but overall i am pleased with the progress that has been made over the time span of SS06 and SS08.
I respect EVERYONE's opinion and i respect everyone as members of this community, but, i think that because we are different, we all think differently, and act different in situations.
Lets all get along, i'm willing to make up with people i've had disagreements with in this thread. Like Marty for example. And i want to treat everyone the same.
Jack.
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Hi All.
I dont think ShipSim08 is not bad.
I dont play missions because im dont have so good computers for mission. but in Free Roam and Mp its going fast. and i never get tired of playing it.
Thats what i feel for the game.
i will never go tired of playing it. i ;)
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I dont think ShipSim08 isnt bad.
That means you think it's bad ???
And we never said anything about the game being bad, we said VSTEP were poor at listening to us ;)
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That means you think it's bad ???
And we never said anything about the game being bad, we said VSTEP were poor at listening to us ;)
i did mean It WASNT BAD. It was not bad at all. ShipSim08 Are the best game i've played ever ;D
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Yeah, when I read that, I thought "Hmmm.. that means it is bad. Should I crack a joke?".
But with all the hot feelings around I thought, I'd better not try to be funny. :'(
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Yeah, when I read that, I thought "Hmmm.. that means it is bad. Should I crack a joke?".
But with all the hot feelings around I thought, I'd better not try to be funny. :'(
you. know. im not good at english. but i did mean It dont was bad
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you. know. im not good at english. but i did mean It dont was bad
Yes, I realised that. I just didn't want to make a joke about it with all of the hot feelings arund here recently.
Don't worry. Your meaning was perfectly obvious.
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If I didn't like SS08 I wouldn't have bought it. I enjoyed SS06 and I aprreciate the improvemants made over these many months. I also own NH and am well plesed with the product.
What I will say again is...I would like to see more interactivity in the game. More things that work on each vessel and therefore more options in the missions. What I don't like to see is going to a completely new game every couple of years. Most of us out here in ShipSimLand have limited funds and can't upgrade our hadware that often.
WW
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In a perfect simworld, games would be upgraded endlessly and not replaced... And they would get better and better and better without a limit.
Unfortunatly, there is not enough money to be made that way for one thing. The really big boys do it too, microsoft releases a new FS each couple of years aswell. So from a business standpoint, it's necessary to replace games, to be able to make games in the first place, so to speak. :)
Some changes can not be made without creating something new from scratch, a lot of 'systems' can only be upgraded or worked out within certain limits. So technically, Every game is heading for a dead end, right from day 1, eventually there is no more room for MAJOR improvement or change.
That's why it's better to create a new game when the major features can possibly be replaced by better things, rather than continuing on the same thing.
Well that's how I see it.
And I agree with you, I would like to see much more 'control' over things. I'd like to see it evolve towards what flightsims offer, lots and lots of systems to be run and monitored on board and more things to do with the ships aswell as the enviroment.
Regards,
Fred
* edit; typo