Ship Simulator
English forum => Ship Simulator Extremes => Topic started by: PoRL on October 13, 2010, 20:29:03
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OK, I've got the first patch, I've got the second patch, I've even got the update to the second patch (isn't that the third patch? Never mind...!), and I now think I have sufficient data to come to a conclusion.
Ship Simulator Extremes is a bit rubbish, really.
OK, now let's justify that..
There are flying AI boats! The floating AI boats are all on drugs. The missions are as buggy as hell (in the very first core mission, I've towed the Red Jet to its new location, and now I'm told to tow a non-existent container ship somewhere!). Players have reported that the physics of some boats are acting weird (you steer left, it goes right!). The list goes on and on and on...
We're told that SSE will "eventually" be fixed like earlier versions were. Erm.... I'm not interested in earlier versions; I brought THIS version. The money wasn't taken out of my account "eventually", it was taken out "immediately"!! It's too late to get a refund as I (stupidly) thought that the 1.2 patch would resolve the major issues, and waited (do I feel conned? yes I do, actually).
If SSE is intended as a showcase of VSTEP's talents when plugging their "professional" simulator, then you can't help feeling they've shot themselves in the foot somewhat! If I was planning to spend a six figure sum on a professional sim and I saw SSE... I'd be running away in the opposite direction!
Recent history suggests that the next version of Ship Simulator will be coming out in 2012. I'm sorry, but I know I won't be buying it. Nor, I suspect, will many other people....
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I understand your fustraiton with the buggs, but come on! the people at V-Step are only human {I think ;) } So give them a break. ;)
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PoRL, I can sign on everything you say here.
A interesting thing is that Vstep think that I should accept that the product I got when I bought it was not complete, but will be in the future. Now have I passed the time to get a refund so we can say I have accept it.
Would the acceptance go the opposite way, would Vstep accepted that I paid first 5 € and later 5 more and so on?
I do not think they had, I don't think Vstep had send me the game if I had paid them in the way they had supported the game to me.
I have also thinking about to buy Nautis(Vstep's real simulator, which is not a game), but after I have seen how they have behaved with this program so will I never do that, and I will never recommend their products to anyone. So they have lost a custommer, cause now I will look for another simulator. And what amaze me most is that I have not seen one ord where they asking for an appollogy, instead they have came with lies and hoped that they could survive with that, but lies will always be descovered sooner or later.
But I am convinced that Vstep will fix this game(even if it is too late for them to convince me to buy any more product from them).
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I have also thinking about to buy Nautis(Vstep's real simulator, which is not a game)
You do realise that Nautius used to be called Ship Simulator Pro, and that they cost several thousands Euros?
There is a topic on this, and gives a bit more background information about where Nautis came from.....
http://80.95.161.114/shipsim/forum/index.php/topic,18325.0.html
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I don't think it will break Vsteps heart that they lost one customer. Btw good luck on finding another simulator, that even close to be as good as this, seriously, good luck.
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I don't think it will break Vsteps heart that they lost one customer. Btw good luck on finding another simulator, that even close to be as good as this, seriously, good luck.
Agreed, I used to have Virtual Sailor and it's nowhere as good as Vstep. Yes, there are hundreds of vessels available for VS, but at the expense of quality missions offered by Vstep's Ship Simulator series. When I had to reformat my HD for changeover from XP to Windows 7, I didn't bother reinstalling VS again.
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I understand your fustraiton with the buggs, but come on! the people at V-Step are only human {I think ;) } So give them a break. ;)
[sarcasm]
Well, they had one year and more to develope this game, so I think they had a lot of cofee brakes before they released this...uhm overhyped (arcade game).
Sorry VSTEP, I suppose you need one more year to fix this...(uhm...and not a brake) :lol:
[/sarcasm]
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nobodys perfect :)
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Agreed, I used to have Virtual Sailor and it's nowhere as good as Vstep. Yes, there are hundreds of vessels available for VS, but at the expense of quality missions offered by Vstep's Ship Simulator series. When I had to reformat my HD for changeover from XP to Windows 7, I didn't bother reinstalling VS again.
I agree with you, I will never get VS, as long as Ship Simulator is around. Yes, there might be more bugs, but think of all the controls, and detailed maps. Alot better than VS.
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Well said PoRL,
The forum is full of complaints about problems. Moderators, etc, etc, etc, can defend Vstep all they like but it is rubbish and has lots and lots of very unhappy customers.
I have not seen many posts praising how wonderfull SSE is!
If this were any other type of product then every countries trading standards would be inundated with complaints about such a poor product that was not at all fit for purpose at release.
Perhaps I could sell some stuff to the people who defend SSE as they seem happy to have something that doesn't work as it promises in all the hype and advertising. Perhaps a chocolate tea pot, it melts now, but maybe in the future there will be a fix that will stop the chocolate melting!!!!!!!!
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I have to say, I love the chocolate teapot analogy! ;D
You win the whole of the internet as a prize....
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Perhaps we should start a thread to get a petition together to send to Microsoft to see if they could use learning from Flight Sim to deliver a good Ship Sim?
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I sure hope they don't send the data of their first handful of years, then. ::)
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They have those years of rubbish behind them now. They have a headstart on V-Step and may do a good job. Perhaps the market is not big enough for them though.
I have been using Flight Sim since it was on 2 floppy disks!!
At least when they launch a new version it works, even though some patches do get added later.
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Okay understood. The duality is clear to me now. Thanks for your explaination. ;D
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I loved SS06 and 08 despite the "issues" but they did have good functionality when launched, guess that's why I, as many other users, are upset with SSE. the forum is being used to vent these frustrations. :-\
I think V-Step fell foul of the pressure to release after putting the launch back and back. I really do hope the fixes and patches give us what we all want, then we can start using the forums for help with missions and tips and "how to's" again....like it used to be! :)
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Yes.. 'like it used to be' seems a very nice place to get to again! :thumbs:
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There is a lot that VSTEP can learn from the reviews already written by some game sites on the web :P
Like this one for example:
By far the most disappointing aspect of the game is the lack of depth and realism, which is unforgivable for a simulator. There are a selection of controllable navigation lights, but only a fraction of what would be required on a real ship - plus there's no one telling you off for using the wrong ones anyway. The radar and chart displays are dire and have next to no functions other than basic visual display. The instructions claim that the radar is only for orientation, ignoring other roles and avoiding the need to add in other features.
Ship Simulator Extremes Review Ship Simulator Extremes
In contrast, Flight Simulator X has fully functional radios and GPS that behave in much the same way as the real things. Combined with fairly convincing air traffic control, they make for some attention-grabbing and often quite challenging situations, as well as offering plenty to learn and adding massive depth.
Site: http://www.bit-tech.net/gaming/pc/2010/09/05/ship-simulator-extremes-review/2 (http://www.bit-tech.net/gaming/pc/2010/09/05/ship-simulator-extremes-review/2)
All sim and no game make Jack a dull boy
And even that niche audience may have come to expect more from their simulations these days. Playing Ship Simulator Extremes is like brushing your teeth. Other than the ebb and flow of waves and the sound of some birds, the game is lifeless. It's a sterile, clinical exercise in maneuvering a variety of vessels through a linear series of objective.
Although a sailing and marine simulator might potentially be rife with the joy of exploration in beautifully-crafted, diverse marine environments, Ship Simulator Extremes doesn't deliver that experience. Even if it is the greatest ship/sailing simulator the world over, it just isn't very fun to play. We can't recommend Ship Simulator Extremes for any but the most die-hard boat simulation fans, and we're doubtful that even that tiny niche of an audience would find the game to be compelling for long.
Site: http://www.examiner.com/pc-game-in-national/ship-simulator-extremes-review (http://www.examiner.com/pc-game-in-national/ship-simulator-extremes-review)
Ship Simulator Extremes is certainly better than its predecessor, but not significantly so. What you do get is the typical array of new items: plenty of ships to helm and a number of detailed environments. The mission structure is generally the same, with an emphasis on waypoint navigation with the occasional tow, goods transport, or use of water cannons. I do like the tie-in with Greenpeace, lending some authenticity to your nautical adventures. Objective locations are clearly marked on your map and usually helpful descriptions of what to do next accompany them. There is a fair amount of content here, although the promise of a future editor sweetens the long-term prospects of Ship Simulator Extremes. The free roaming mode remains too free: there is really no point to it. Unfortunately, the promise of cooperative multiplayer suffers a similar downfall: while you can play with others, you have to make up your own objectives. Ship Simulator Extremes needs to add more structure (like dynamic missions) to the freeform mode and robust online play to become a truly impressive simulation. The controls feature easy access to tools for anchoring and towing, but odd mouse-driven options and limitations for the keyboard make controlling Ship Simulator Extremes a bit more cumbersome than necessary. Autopilot cuts down on some of the boredom associated with straight, unimpeded navigation of the open ocean, and the graphics are generally excellent. Still, I have a lot of the same complaints as last time, and after refreshing my memory by reading that review, I’m a little astonished by how little the series has progressed in three years. The AI tries its best to sabotage your missions, controls are iffy, and the multiplayer mode feels incomplete. Fans of ship simulations might find another good time, but more significant improvements are required to reel in an expanded audience.
Site: http://www.outofeight.info/2010/09/ship-simulator-extremes-review.html (http://www.outofeight.info/2010/09/ship-simulator-extremes-review.html)
That wasn’t the only glitch I came across either, during the very first Greenpeace mission I was asked to deploy a small speedboat and closely tail a container ship that was suspected of dumping oil barrels into the ocean for thirty seconds. As I got closer, it started flickering from one location to another – not only did that mean I was almost squashed by it when getting nearby, but also made it impossible to complete the objective as every time it moved away, the timer was reset. I guess it must have been one of those ghost ships you see on Scooby Doo.
Perhaps I’m being a little hard on it, you may think, it’s meant for a certain audience and maybe that audience isn’t me? Not at all, I’ve had countless fun with other simulators, including those that involve sitting back and waiting until you reach your destination. In this case, however, it all just feels unfinished. Even the most hardcore simulator fans out there will find it hard to enjoy, as there’s just not a whole lot of depth to the game. The most tricky thing I came across was mooring my ship when returning to port, and that was because I was unsure of which key to press – which wasn’t helped by the inability to bring up an options menu or command list without quitting my current game.
Site: http://ironhammers.org/?p=2298 (http://ironhammers.org/?p=2298)
That isn't to say that I found Ship Simulator to be boring per se, but even with the relatively short missions in the campaigns there were long periods of abject nothingness to deal with. Let's just stipulate that the “Extremes†in the title refers to the endpoints of a level-of-activity continuum that is inordinately wide. In other words, there is an extreme difference between the interest level of docking a ship and the nearly hypnotic passing of the featureless water landscape while cruising along between activities. You get this in airplanes too, of course, which is why they have autopilots and the sims typically have an accelerated time mode.
Site: http://www.gamingnexus.com/Article/Ship-Simulator-Extremes/Item2762.aspx (http://www.gamingnexus.com/Article/Ship-Simulator-Extremes/Item2762.aspx)
Ship Simulator Extremes is a good platform that has a lot of potential. The desire to include too many ship types, and perhaps too many environments I feel leaves a few other areas lacking. The mission designs are basic, rather easy, and not very inspiring. Ship handling skills can be important, but you can also fudge your way through and just try to accomplish the bare minimum amount of maneuvering to reach the destination waypoint and get a poorly positioned mooring line to the wharf. While damage can be accumulated for poor ship handling, there is no visible damage model — you just end up sinking. Unfortunately, you’ll find that much of Ship Simulator Extremes just doesn’t live up to the last word in the title. Slapping an exciting word on a title might guarantee you some buzz, but you have deliver on the promise. The sim misses the mark because it misses in too many areas. A mission editor is promised in the coming weeks that might open the sim up to more creative minds (hopefully). Personally though, I wish I could have waited for it to go on sale on Steam for 80% off if that ever happens.
Site: http://www.simhq.com/_naval/naval_029b.html (http://www.simhq.com/_naval/naval_029b.html)
As the educational tool that the developers claim it can be used as, Ship Simulator Extremes does a decent job of conveying the difficulties of a captain’s job. As a game though, it lacks the fun factor that would have made the experience more tolerable. It is stuck awkwardly in between the realms of immersive simulation and full-fledged game. The restrictions on what you can do with your boat hinders its immersive qualities, while the ridiculously slow pacing of the more game-oriented missions make it lack the excitement it is supposed to generate. Hardcore enthusiasts may find a couple of things to like here, but everybody else should stay clear from this game.
Site: http://diehardgamefan.com/2010/09/28/review-ship-simulator-extremes-pc/ (http://diehardgamefan.com/2010/09/28/review-ship-simulator-extremes-pc/)
So, even if many of those reviews are positive, they seem to fall back on one single thing that SSE doesn't deliver, realism. I think that VSTEP should be very careful to take those reviews for granted when they start pulling the next Ship Simulator version out of the box I think it's about time to start listen to all the hardcore fans, those who prefer a simulator that delivers realism, not an arcade or a racing sim where everything is minimized, and every single operation that can be done on board a ship and the bridge is excluded.
I mean, why is this board visited by people that got gaming experience from Flight Simulator? Well, they visit this board to tell about another simulator, a typical hardcore simulator called FSX...and they got all the rights to do that, comparing SSE with any simulator out there. The same list of missing things that SSE doesn't yet have is written again and again from one member to another..and you find that list in almost every review written out there.
I find this press release at IGN posted in July a little bit funny. The headline says
Ship Simulator Extremes Continues its Dedication to Realism
..uhm..realism?
The first line in the article says..
Ship Simulator Extremes is known for its extreme dedication to realism and accuracy.
Oh really? It also says...
All game content has been created with blue prints and in collaboration with seasoned maritime captains worldwide
Wow...that mus be a lot of people involved, even worldwide?
Ship Simulator Extremes offers exciting missions all over the world...
Uhm..all over the world? Where is Norway then...I mean, anyone can clearly see that this statement is completely out of scale. We cannot sail all over the world yet.. ::)
Why I quoted the press release article at IGN is because I want to warn about one thing..and that is forget hyping the game skyhigh, because people will find it out anyway, thanks to the game reviewers. ;)
So my point is, credits to all game reviewers out there, credits to all who complains about bugs, credits to all those who share their wishes, credits to even those who freaks out, credits to those who didn't buy the hype and credit to myself for pointing this out yet again...
In long term time will tell where this game end, so VSTEP, listen carefully to your audience this time, because next time there is enough of clever people out there that know when to spend or not to spend money on this sim/game when a new title comes out. ;)
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I really do hope the fixes and patches give us what we all want, then we can start using the forums for help with missions and tips and "how to's" again....like it used to be! :)
Amen to that.. :thumbs: I'm getting a bit tired of the negativity..
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Amen to that.. :thumbs: I'm getting a bit tired of the negativity..
But you continue to read it?
If you are tired of it, just stop read. Or you might be a masochist?
Of cource is it not funny with so many negative comments, but what suspect with a game like this. If the game had been what it was told that it should be, I think most persons had played the game instead of writing complaints here.
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I think most persons had played the game instead of writing complaints here.
Unless they are masochists.. ;)
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But you continue to read it?
If you are tired of it, just stop read. Or you might be a masochist?
That is very good advice wiqvist. I have a short list of those whose posts have convinced me that it would be a waste of my time to ever look at another one of theirs on any board.
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Reading all of this comments published en several magazines, I confirm my idea. VStep have very good intentions, but it seems they don`t understand very well this niche of audience. They have made an "educational tool" . We must not forget the original activity of VStep.
There is another thing perhaps a bit delicate. I wouldn`t want to be bad-mannered, but VStep seems to consider we will never deserver to have many things in this simulator: Maritime control traffic, tides, ballast, authentic depictions of bridge controls. The expression used for Frank: "There are users expecting things only reserved for 250.000 € simulators in one 39.99 € simulator" is very significant.
Well Frank, A 250.000 € simulator is not what we want exactly, but a Simulator able to grow at consecutive modules with new features and performances, and paying for them; of course, that's we`d like. I don`t know if VStep is closing itself a great opportunity.
In another hand the border between professional and entuthiastic people and fans can be really relative. I can`t understand how in this enterprise are working in two ship simulators at the same time. It seems a waste or resources.
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There is another thing perhaps a bit delicate. I wouldn`t want to be bad-mannered, but VStep seems to consider we will never deserver to have many things in this simulator: Maritime control traffic, tides, ballast, authentic depictions of bridge controls. The expression used for Frank: "There are users expecting things only reserved for 250.000 € simulators in one 39.99 € simulator" is very significant.
Hear, hear..... that's a great idea, a modular simulator which you can extend periodically, so you can grow in it and the costs can be spread over a longer time (let's buy that great radar module this month :D).
could be a killer idea for Vstep, players who wants to invest 40 to 50 euro several times a year?
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There is another thing perhaps a bit delicate. I wouldn`t want to be bad-mannered, but VStep seems to consider we will never deserver to have many things in this simulator: Maritime control traffic, tides, ballast, authentic depictions of bridge controls. The expression used for Frank: "There are users expecting things only reserved for 250.000 € simulators in one 39.99 € simulator" is very significant.
I try to stay away from these threads, for fear that I offend anyone, which is not my aim
however I feel this is probably the main problem with the "Game"
When SSE came out it had no buoys in, a basic navigation aid, when we asked where they had gone, we were informed by one of the main developer chaps, they were removed to make sure that the academies/training centres went for SSPro and not SSE, make sure the difference was big enough...
And I think this is the problem...
Anyway apologies, I still enjoy the game, and I am looking forward to the Updates which can make SSE a great SIMULATION, as well as the CCC contest
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FSX has all if not many of the professional systems simulated- especially if you purchase a PMDG aircraft; you CAN NOT fly a PMDG aircraft unless you go through all the checklists, do all the procedures and set up the FMC properly. Failure to do so will result in crashing before even lifting-off. FSX has been able to emcompass ALL of their 'professional' systems into a package that went for $59.99 USD. And yes, FSX is and can be used for PROFESSIONAL training.
Like others, Im perplexed why asking for the same type of features that are included in the 59.99 version of FSX would be considered the same as something in a multithousand dollar simulation program. Why can Microsoft come up with a high-fidelity, highly technical SIMULATION for 59 bucks, yet VStep can not.
The simulator part really is a thorn in my side though. Its misrepresenting the software, because no matter how you put it, this is a 'game' and you have to stretch your imagination pretty far to make this a 'simulator'. When a BIG company such as VStep , in my opinion, should not be in any way, misrepresenting what they are selling...
When at anytime can you walk into the bridge of a large vessel, push the throttles to full ahead and she sets off?? In the real-world, plain and simple, that does not occur. Generators need to be fired up first. Systems needs to stabilize before main engines are started or engaged. Fuel and lubrication levels are a BIG check. I could go on, but I think the point is made. :)
Thoughts?? Opinions??
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I have to admit, I'm also disappointed. I expected much more improvement compared to SS08. I miss the love for detail. But one should also mention, that this is also a money problem. I don't think shipsim is calculated with that many buyers the MS FS series was. So the amount of resources in developing the ship "simulator" are limited. Maybe that's the mistake, since a better product could reach more customers.
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PORL and JHB
are right.
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Maybe they have aimed to high with to little recources.
SS06 was a lot of fun, while the graphics where crap and a lot of other things to, but most things just worked. And most of all, it was a simulation, not a hybrid of simulation/game.
Mark
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Well I am, quite underwhelmed.
Myself; fifteen years in the United States Merchant Marine, offshore Hazardous Chemical Barge Captain.
My computer; HP quad core intel i975 extreme 3.33 processor, with 24GB of ram driving a thirty inch HP LP3065 professional monitor.
Neither of us were impressed. 'Siegfried' my pc was looking forward to a visual feast, instead it is graphically mediocre at best.
The physics are all wrong. A modern tug built to the 3 to 1 standard, that is to say, one foot width to every three feet of length does not roll like an older 6to 1 Navy 'Standard' tug.
A three to one is more stable in normal conditions, however in heavy seas she does not roll, but slams down bow first so hard you'll think your teeth will slam through the roof of your mouth.
Either way a graceful six to one or a modern three to one, neither are as pleasant in heavy seas as this 'simulation' suggests. Six to nine foot rollers in the Gullfstream can roll you out of your bunk, and nine to twelve foot swells are the the reason most small offshore tugs have a seatbelt in the Captain's chair.
Patton used to say there are no atheists in a foxhole, and I'll add, I never saw one in a tug in heavy seas either.
I was in 'Andrew', 'Gilbert', 'Hugo' and the 'noname' storm (re-dubbed perfect storm for Hollywood) and I can tell you the situation was each time dire. Each time we dove into the troughs we wondered if we'd come back up, and each time we slid crazily off the crests we prayed the tow cables would not jerk us backwards under the seas. In between we held our breaths and looked warily over at our barge that just seemed to be topping it's own crest high above us as if any second it would close the gap behind us to slam down on our heads.
I get no sense of impending doom running a sim tug through hurricane force winds. It is just way too tame, the Gulf Stream off the coast of Florida will have the tug 'dancing' far more than that during a 'small craft advisory'.
And why so few American ships? Once American flagged ships were 80% of the world's fleet. These vessels did not just go away, they have just been re-flagged outside our borders to save our corporate scum from paying their fair share of taxes.
The most Powerful tug ever built is still the Coastal Port Everglades, 10,500 ship hp pushing the biggest hot oil barge ever made. The two of which make up a tug and barge combination, which come to think of it seem o also be missing from your game.
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As a boat owner and having spent 13 years at sea I know there are alot of things that could be simulated. An example is transverse thrust and propellor walk. I don't think this is simulated in Extremes. Also weather is cool but what about tides and that sort of stuff. I know when plotting a course in real life you have to take wind and tides into account. I thought when purchasing this product I was getting something that resembled Flight Sim X. I have owned that programme since it came out and all flight sims before it. I fly real aircraft and can safely say it is a true simulator :2thumbs:. I have spent hundreds of dollars on scenery and Addon aircraft for FSX and was hoping that this simulator would be the same :thumbdown:. There is the making of an awesome product here with extremes and for the developer to sell addons such as new ports and vessels :thumbs:. At the moment I wonder if it meets the strict consumer laws here in New Zealand ???. Is it what I was lead to believe I was purchasing? No. Has the supplier moved quickly to remedy any problems? Yes but in some cases made it worse. I.E I can not even drive one of my Fav ships because the bow thruster does not work one way. >:( To me this game has failed to deliver. I only hope that subsequent updates come quickly and improve the game to make it a true simulator.
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I mistakenly had thought that SSE would be an important improvement on SS08 but instead it was a serious disappointment.
Let's be honest : SSE is a mere game and definitely NOT a simulator, worthy the name, as one would be made to believe when buying a DVD bearing the name of Ship Simulator. Unworthy the name of Vstep. I sincerely hope that a number of updates will bring some real improvement. Meanwhile I have removed the program from my PC. Sorry for the money.
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Agree with u, I hope they read the reviews on the site and do something about it!
I though this was gonna be the game of the year ....... :sleepy:
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Same here - huge disappointment. I wish all the best for Vstep and appreciate all work/time spent on this new title, but when it slowly sinks behind SS08, it shows the whole concept failed. Hopefully, they will pick it up and make major progress in the name of "simulation". It certainly is not a sim anymore.
sorry to say,
Broms
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I understand your fustraiton with the buggs, but come on! the people at V-Step are only human {I think ;) } So give them a break. ;)
Thank goodness the people who make kettles and coffee makers are still only human but all their stuff works straight out of the box!
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Well guys i have cracked it!!!! As a typical male,i did what one does when he gets something new to play with?? He fails to read the instructions!!! :doh: After reading the little instructions that came with the game I have learned that I can control the POR bow thrusters with the keyboard. Sweet I am at sea again in the big beast! :2thumbs:
HMMMM instructions.... i wonder if thats why I have to stand on my head to watch tv after I wall mounted it???? ;)
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Thank goodness the people who make kettles and coffee makers are still only human but all their stuff works straight out of the box!
Hrmmm... Nope!
Robots make the coffee machines ;)
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I don't play to it, and i don't know where he is because it's a rubbish, it's true. And VStep don't delete the BEAUTIFUL picture of their home page.